I was wondering what experience others had with alcohol stoves?

I was playing with my Trangia testing out pots at about 32 degrees. It did fine, boiling 1qt of water with about 1oz of fuel. I got reasonable boil times (~9min) compared to my liquid fuel and cartridge stoves (~6min).But, the gas stoves still used half the fuel weight though - typically about 0.5oz/qt.

I did notice that the height of the pot above the stove was a big factor, at least on the Trangia. It seems to like about 1" or so, otherwise it burns much much slower, and I had a hard time boiling water at 32 degrees.

I like the alcohol stove, but it seems like you'd want to pair it with a wood burner for a long trip to really justify it - that fuel weight really ads up. I think that stick burner posted by bwcasolo on another thread is interesting.

Some random links:

Vargo stove box
Emberlit stove box firebox stove box
Trangia Stove Burner
Caldera sidewinder wood/alcohol stove
Starlyte Stove

I use a Trangia in a Clikstand base for heating any water for drinking and for cooking. It works great for the kind of cooking and foods I carry, which are simple and easy to prepare.

I use a home made stick stove, made from a 3 lb coffee can, for heating all cleaning water - saves a lot of fuel. It is also a back up stove for cooking if needed.

Both stoves nest in a dedicated water heating pot. Have never camped in the BWCA where there wasn't plenty of fuel for the stick stove, and always have all the hot water needed for cleaning and washing.

Stick stove in action:

Out of curiosity, which type of alcohol were you burning? I have a Trangia but have not put it to the test really yet, so am curious about this too.

I used crown denatured alcohol from the hardware store paint dept.

Another beginner thing I learned - use the simmer ring to snuff out the stove, not the cap with the rubber "O" ring. Let the stove cool a bit before putting on the "O" ring cap. Don't ask me how I know.

HEET in the yellow bottle is acceptable also.

I use a trangia with my littlbug sr. Woodburner. An Open Country 4qt. pot hangs in there right above the flame. I used it this winter at -20F. I did not time it or keep track of fuel.

Mike

I use a Trangia, but I also have a stick burner. The Trangia works particularly well because of the "nested" wind screen. The only downside I find with the Trangia is that it does use a lot of fuel. That's why I also carry a stick burner. The stick burner is a "Vital" stove, which uses fan forced air. It will boil a pot of water in about half the time of the Trangia, but you must constantly feed it.

I burn denatured alcohol from the hardware store. I carry it in the Trangia fuel bottles.

Trangia and Vital Stove.

quote awbrown: "I use a Trangia, but I also have a stick burner. The Trangia works particularly well because of the "nested" wind screen. The only downside I find with the Trangia is that it does use a lot of fuel. That's why I also carry a stick burner. The stick burner is a "Vital" stove, which uses fan forced air. It will boil a pot of water in about half the time of the Trangia, but you must constantly feed it.


"

Does it make a scar on the ground? Is it a lot of fuss to deal with the ashes? How much soot do you get? Thanks.

Solo I use a Trangia with a clickstand. I have made my own as well, but I like being able to screw the lid on after it cools so that I don't have to drain out any of the extra fuel. I also use the Trangia with the simmer ring with my 8" Fry-Bake oven.

The height does make a big difference with the boil times and fuel usage. I can get just a little better time using a stand made from hardware cloth vs. the clickstand. But it works better for me with the clickstand and Fry-Bake. I did some playing around checking times last year and was going to make a spread sheet up but have yet to do it.

I have been an alcohol convert for two years. I use a SoloStove stick burner as my pot stand and windscreen with 8 oz. V8 can alcohol stoves. If I run out of fuel I can use sticks and cook just the same.

There are two stoves in my kit, one low power to fry and one high power to boil. In fact, I used a new low power version I made the other day to make pancakes this morning. This one was made from a 12oz. Mountain Dew aluminum bottle.

For fuel I found the best is Kleen Strip denatured alcohol (ethanol) and yellow HEET (methanol). Either way, I like use the yellow bottles for storage on trips. A small measuring cup from an instant iced tea tub is in the kit marked with a half and one oz. marks.

quote DeterminedOrange: "I have been an alcohol convert for two years. I use a SoloStove stick burner as my pot stand and windscreen with 8 oz. V8 can alcohol stoves. If I run out of fuel I can use sticks and cook just the same.


There are two stoves in my kit, one low power to fry and one high power to boil. In fact, I used a new low power version I made the other day to make pancakes this morning. This one was made from a 12oz. Mountain Dew aluminum bottle.


For fuel I found the best is Kleen Strip denatured alcohol (ethanol) and yellow HEET (methanol). Either way, I like use the yellow bottles for storage on trips. A small measuring cup from an instant iced tea tub is in the kit marked with a half and one oz. marks."

I assume 1/2 oz boils 2 cups? Do you measure both your water and your alcohol? Also, how do you measure alcohol for frying? Thanks.

I have collected burn time data on about a dozen different stoves and found that time to boil and amount of fuel are inverse to a point. You can boil two cups in about 9 minutes with a third oz. or 5 minutes with a half oz. and so on. Also, heat feedback makes a huge difference, enclosing the stove in the stick stove vs. on the ground causes a much more rapid burning, quicker boils and more fuel consumption.

For measuring I use the little measuring cup I mentioned and for water use a graduated Nalgene. For frying I just estimate time required and use enough fuel for that long. For example, I tested and found the new bamboo shoot stove can run something like 30 minutes with 1 oz. of fuel when in the SoloStove as a stand. This is what I used to cook a dozen pancakes this morning and had about 5 minutes extra fuel which is a good idea anyway since it is hard to add more when hot. Note they were pretty small pancakes as I was using a Trangia 27 fry pan.

It appears that I may be using my trangia inefficiently. I just fill up the reservoir with fuel and cook as needed, put out with the simmer ring, and screw the cap on when cool. It seems that some of you are measuring your fuel by the ounce, and burning up the fuel each time you cook. Am I missing something?

quote crumpman: "It appears that I may be using my trangia inefficiently. I just fill up the reservoir with fuel and cook as needed, put out with the simmer ring, and screw the cap on when cool. It seems that some of you are measuring your fuel by the ounce, and burning up the fuel each time you cook. Am I missing something?"

I don't think so. The Trangia has that nice feature where you can snuff it out when done and save the fuel, something the homemade stoves really can't. Letting them burn out should give no added benefit for efficiency that I can think of.

More important seems to be the windscreen and how the heat from the flame contacts the pot or pan. The flame wrapping up around the sides are not efficient and probably why Trangia did such a nice job of making their pots and pans fit their windscreens.

The only reason I don't use the Trangia stove is the 4 oz. weight vs. .3 oz. for a pop can version.

i always think of these as something for the lightweight gang who dole out fuel by the ounce after many cooking tests at home.
my only use has been in the drive in camps the night before going into the BW.


Gaz and other stoves give you more lee way but the alcohol stoves call for a lot more practice to get the most out of them.

Always liked those Trangia sets, what nice design work they did.

Images of my alcohol cook kit.

Bundled up, 29.2 oz. with empty bottle.


Exploded kit.


High power stove with tea kettle.


Low power stove with total block windscreen.

i have 2, and love them. a fancee feest stove as my main stove for my msr titanium solo pot, and a stove from white box.
the white box stove has flame jets out of the side which works better for my small fry pan, and the fancee feest has an upright flame which works best for my msr.
I use heet in the yellow bottle.
I only boil 2 cups of water at a time.

I used my white box while hammock camping at ten degrees this winter with no problems. Of course, I slept with the yellow bottle of Heet inside my hammock.

I really liked the fancee feast stove when I tried it. But playing around with that and my Trangia, I found that I liked having a pot stand versus putting the pot right on the stove - less tippy. I am kind of thinking of making one of those V8 can stoves, and then making a or buying a firebox/pot stand/windscreen. But which of the half dozen V8 can stove designs out on the web should I make? The penny stove version? The design with the big hole in the middle that seems a lot like the Trangia? I don't have a clue yet.

quote NotLight: "
I really liked the fancee feast stove when I tried it. But playing around with that and my Trangia, I found that I liked having a pot stand versus putting the pot right on the stove - less tippy. I am kind of thinking of making one of those V8 can stoves, and then making a or buying a firebox/pot stand/windscreen. But which of the half dozen V8 can stove designs out on the web should I make? The penny stove version? The design with the big hole in the middle that seems a lot like the Trangia? I don't have a clue yet.


"

I like the classic pepsi can stove (link below). Instead of 12oz I used 8oz for the stoves I carry. The 12oz versions have more power but do not work as well with small pots as they waste heat with flames extending beyond the sides. I added a second creased wall inside the high power version to obtain faster bloom (about 20 seconds).

Wikipedia pepsi can stove

Personally I do not like the penny stove. It is hard to start, even indoors with room temp and no wind requires priming. The flame pattern is huge and does not work well with the pots I have.

I have made several Trangia clones and was not a fan of these either. It is difficult to copy the original and the clones just didn`t perform. The heavy brass as well as internal wicking they have make them very reliable.

quote DeterminedOrange: "Always liked those Trangia sets, what nice design work they did.


Images of my alcohol cook kit.


Bundled up, 29.2 oz. with empty bottle.



Exploded kit.



High power stove with tea kettle.



Low power stove with total block windscreen.
"

D.O., where did you find the plans to build your 2 stoves?.....oops, I missed a post. How about the other one

I had posed the following question (which I'm moving here) in the other thread:

How much alcohol would I need to heat 2X 12 ounces for breakfast/dinner, plus 3X 8 ounces for coffee/tea, 5 burns?

The 2 answers were 1.2 ounces and 3 ounces, which is a considerable difference.

The difference could be due to variances in stove design efficiency, temperature, or wind conditions. I would primarily be using it in late Sept/early October.

Anybody else?

I'm trying to determine if I'd save weight or add weight by switching to an alcohol (or tri-fuel) stove from my JetBoil for a 12-day solo trip. I also have to weigh the other advantages and disadvantages, as well as weight.

I can save a few ounces with the alcohol system (or tri-fuel), but. . .

If I need 2-3 ounces of alcohol a day, that would be a lot of fuel weight - say about 32 ounces for the trip. . .

Of course, with a tri-fuel stove, I could take less alcohol/fuel tabs and use wood some of the time . . .

Thoughts? Numbers?

Pretty much just took the basic concept and adapted from the cans you have. Note that all cans are not exactly the same size, just use two of the same for that style. I like the V8 juice or red bull cans the best.

Cut out the inner dome of the can that will become the top. Use something sharp like a utility knife (a drywall screw can work well too) and go around the edge where the dome meets the bottom ridge of the can. Go around and around until you have a decent groove, then push a sharp object to make a cut in this groove. From there you should be able to just push around the seam and pop out the dome. Deburr with sandpaper.

Decide on your final height, cut the bottom part tall enough to go up to beginning of the taper of the top. Cut the top to overlap the bottom 3/8 inch. Note on cutting, I mark the height by stacking up some stuff where a sharpy on the top contacts the can at the desired point. Spin the can to make a nice line around it. Make an initial cut with a utility knife within a 1/4 inch of your mark and use a scissors to make your final cut.

Use any pop can to cut out the inner wall section. Check out many of the web sites that show you how to make this. Basically cut on top of one end and bottom of other. Slip the cuts together and you have a tube. This tube should fit snuggly around the domes in the can bottoms you will join.

The hardest part is fitting the top over the bottom section. I found it best to heat the edge of the top section with a torch or lighter until the paint starts to tarnish. Use a can of the same size and push GENTLY into the top which will deform it just enough to allow it to slip over the bottom. Note: when you do the final assembly make sure everything is ready,it is tough to get apart without destroying the parts.

Have fun!

I was interested in the low power stove. Haven't seen that design. I've made many different types. My personal fave is a wick type stove.

quote cowdoc: "I was interested in the low power stove. Haven't seen that design. I've made many different types. My personal fave is a wick type stove. "

The go to low power is a taller (2.5" I think) traditional pop can stove (also called open jet) made from two red bull cans. It has only 8 jets that are pretty small, not sure the size but about 1/32". Start really small and enlarge until it burns out of jets without surging.

The new low power I am still testing is from a video I saw on Youtube, search for bamboo shoot alcohol stove. I used a different bottle, found an aluminum MD bottle, not sure if they are made anymore. Maybe you could try a Miller Lite aluminum bottle (find a friend to drink it for you so you don't have to stomach it : ) ) Still need to find the best capillary center tube, differing from the original design, I used a multi-layer tube with very fine grooves and all clamped together.

Let me know if you make one and how yours worked for you.

quote boonie: "I had posed the following question (which I'm moving here) in the other thread:


How much alcohol would I need to heat 2X 12 ounces for breakfast/dinner, plus 3X 8 ounces for coffee/tea, 5 burns?


The 2 answers were 1.2 ounces and 3 ounces, which is a considerable difference.


The difference could be due to variances in stove design efficiency, temperature, or wind conditions. I would primarily be using it in late Sept/early October.


Anybody else?



I'm trying to determine if I'd save weight or add weight by switching to an alcohol (or tri-fuel) stove from my JetBoil for a 12-day solo trip. I also have to weigh the other advantages and disadvantages, as well as weight.


I can save a few ounces with the alcohol system (or tri-fuel), but. . .


If I need 2-3 ounces of alcohol a day, that would be a lot of fuel weight - say about 32 ounces for the trip. . .


Of course, with a tri-fuel stove, I could take less alcohol/fuel tabs and use wood some of the time . . .


Thoughts? Numbers?


"

You are heating 1.5 cups twice a day for meals. assuming you need a boil and can use a cozy, it should be safe to assume you can get by with 1 oz/day for that. Warming 3 cups/day, assuming not a rolling boil at most should be another oz. Total then is 2 oz./day, and I would be comfortable with that assuming you have a really good wind screen, have the stove off the ground and your timing doesn't require you to reheat because you forgot to put the oatmeal in the bowl before the water was hot(yep, I've done it).

I saw a video where a guy used a chunk of that foil face bubble wrap which as a second windscreen around the stove. It works good for cozies but melts if you try to use it for a primary windscreen. This might be good for Oct. weather.

Thanks...bamboo shoot stove. I'll let you know what I find

Thanks, DO-

Your assumptions are correct - with my JetBoil I boil-and-dump with a cozy, don't bring to complete boil for hot drinks, and it boils 12 oz. water so fast that I have everything ready first. It's so efficient that I get a lot of mileage out of a canister, so probably not a weight advantage for the alcohol. I could probably gain some with a tri-fuel if I used wood a lot, but it would have to be a really long trip to make a big dent in total weight.

quote NotLight: "

quote awbrown: "I use a Trangia, but I also have a stick burner. The Trangia works particularly well because of the "nested" wind screen. The only downside I find with the Trangia is that it does use a lot of fuel. That's why I also carry a stick burner. The stick burner is a "Vital" stove, which uses fan forced air. It will boil a pot of water in about half the time of the Trangia, but you must constantly feed it.



"

Does it make a scar on the ground? Is it a lot of fuss to deal with the ashes? How much soot do you get? Thanks.
"

I assume you are asking about the stick burner.......It has a base and legs which hold the burning chamber up off the ground, so it won't leave any scar on the ground. The floor of the burning chamber has a series of tiny holes in it and a small fan blows air through the holes.

It produces very little ash because it burns everything so completely. After cooking a full meal, there would barely be any ash at all. It also doesn't create much soot because it burns so hotly. It does produce more soot then the alcohol stove, but not near as much as a campfire would produce.

When you pack the stove up, the sides fold down into a small package and this slides in between the legs of the base for storage. You then lift off the floor of the burning chamber and store the switch mechanism for the fan in there.

Vital Stove review

quote boonie: "If I need 2-3 ounces of alcohol a day, that would be a lot of fuel weight - say about 32 ounces for the trip. . .
"

That's why I switched to the wood burning Element stove.

quote boonie: "I had posed the following question (which I'm moving here) in the other thread:


How much alcohol would I need to heat 2X 12 ounces for breakfast/dinner, plus 3X 8 ounces for coffee/tea, 5 burns?


The 2 answers were 1.2 ounces and 3 ounces, which is a considerable difference.


The difference could be due to variances in stove design efficiency, temperature, or wind conditions. I would primarily be using it in late Sept/early October.


Anybody else?


I'm trying to determine if I'd save weight or add weight by switching to an alcohol (or tri-fuel) stove from my JetBoil for a 12-day solo trip. I also have to weigh the other advantages and disadvantages, as well as weight.


I can save a few ounces with the alcohol system (or tri-fuel), but. . .


If I need 2-3 ounces of alcohol a day, that would be a lot of fuel weight - say about 32 ounces for the trip. . .


Of course, with a tri-fuel stove, I could take less alcohol/fuel tabs and use wood some of the time . . .


Thoughts? Numbers?


"

I think you're really high on your estimation of 2-3 ozs/day. The 2 12oz burns are no more than .3 ozs each. The 3 8 oz burns are less, but let's say they're also .3ozs each. That's still only 1.5 oz/day.

As I mentioned in the other thread, I bring a quart to a boil with .8 oz and .5 oz was way overkill on a pint. (It literally burned for another 2 minutes after I pulled the pot).

I used to carry 2 oz/day for 2 one quart meals. I got that down to 1.6 oz/day. Now I carry a stick stove and plan for .5 oz/day in case the stick stove stays in the pack.

Current kitchen set up:


Pop can stove (double walled), titanium stick stove, 8 cup pot.

What the pop can stove looks like in use:

quote OBX2Kayak: "

quote boonie: "If I need 2-3 ounces of alcohol a day, that would be a lot of fuel weight - say about 32 ounces for the trip. . .
"

That's why I switched to the wood burning Element stove."

Do you take an alcohol stove with it and use it as a windscreen for your alcohol stove when not burning wood?

If so, what percent of the time do you use the wood burner vs. the alcohol stove?

Their remote feed alcohol stoves look interesting, but I wonder how fuel efficient they are?

quote boonie: "Do you take an alcohol stove with it and use it as a windscreen for your alcohol stove when not burning wood?


If so, what percent of the time do you use the wood burner vs. the alcohol stove?


Their remote feed alcohol stoves look interesting, but I wonder how fuel efficient they are?"

I used to bring the alchy and a tiny amount of fuel as a "back-up." Never needed it, even in some very damp environments so, it no longer comes along.

Once the fire is started, it seems that the Element boils water as rapidly as the alchy but I've never timed it. It obviously takes longer to gather twigs and start the fire but I feel its a small price to pay for not having to carry fuel.

what is your guys opinion on the white box solo II? bought one on a whim but have yet to trip with it.

Thanks, hooky-

It looks like I could get by with 1.5 +/- ounces if I was careful, but still wonder how much it might be affected by temperature and wind. I can remember using an old pop can stove maybe 10-15 years ago and having trouble with it in colder Oct. weather.

You're welcome, boonie.

In colder weather, I hold the lighter flame against the side of the can to heat it and vaporize the alcohol. Once you get it started, it takes care of itself. I've seen some people wrap a heavy wick around the can, squirt a little fuel on it and when it's lit, it will warm it up and vaporize it too.

quote kanoes: "what is your guys opinion on the white box solo II? bought one on a whim but have yet to trip with it."

I've been using the old White Box for years. It's a workhorse. The "Solo II" is new to me. Sounds like it would be good if you cook big meals.

White Box Solo II

quote OBX2Kayak: "

quote kanoes: "what is your guys opinion on the white box solo II? bought one on a whim but have yet to trip with it."

I've been using the old White Box for years. It's a workhorse. The "Solo II" is new to me. Sounds like it would be good if you cook big meals."

the solo II is the smallest one.

Thanks, OBX-

I kind of figured that after you got used to it, you probably wouldn't use much alcohol. The wood burner weighs a little more, but there's no windscreen or fuel bottle, much less any fuel weight, so you could save a fair amount of weight on fuel over a long trip.

It looks like they may be gearing up to produce a smaller, lighter version of the Element Wood Stove you linked.

quote kanoes: "what is your guys opinion on the white box solo II? bought one on a whim but have yet to trip with it."

I haven't tried that one but it appears to be the same as many of the budweiser bottle stoves out there. In the website there is a video endorsement from Steve Green, I bought a tent from him and found his advice spot on. He said the stove can boil 2 cups in 5 minutes with 2/3 oz. alcohol, I'd rank that toward the top of the scale for power and fuel usage.

If you get a chance to try it, let us know it works.

quote kanoes: "what is your guys opinion on the white box solo II? bought one on a whim but have yet to trip with it."

the jets on the whitebox stoves are on the side, where a wider pan sit's directly on top and heats water quickly. my fancee feest stove burns more upward, no side jets, allowing me to use my msr titanium stove, which is only 4 inches wide. I match my pan width's with the flame. white box is an awesome stove.

gkimball, you are my kind of guy. That thing looks quick, easy, field-repairable, recyclable, cheap, strong...just plain great. I'm going to make one.

quote Moss Tent: "gkimball, you are my kind of guy. That thing looks quick, easy, field-repairable, recyclable, cheap, strong...just plain great. I'm going to make one."

Thanks!

I can send you a couple more pictures to get an idea how to make it. About as cheap as you can get, plus it works! Send me your email if you want to.