Has anyone here tripped in BOTH a Magic and a Wilderness? If so, please give me a your thoughts on the pros and cons of both. Also consider I trip on flat water and rivers up to Class 2 with maybe a few Class 3 spots.

i couldnt imagine taking a magic into whitewater.

quote kanoes: "i couldnt imagine taking a magic into whitewater."

I agree... the Magic would not turn or ferry or surf well at all...

It's difficult to comment without knowing the paddler's height and weight.

Actually, Magic turns more tightly than Wilderness because it has significantly more rocker. It;s flaw in class 2 is that the paddler is sitting, a relatively unstable position compared to kneeling. Most Wilderness paddlers sit as well, so that is not a defining characteristic in choosing between the two. Magic's delta shape compromised forward maneuverability. Wilderness's complete lack of rocker similarly compromises it in anything approaching class two, much less three.

Folks headed through class 2 water need more bow rocket and would welcome fuller quarters. WeNoNah's Argosy would be an improvement as would Bell/Northstar's NorthWind Solo, or Merlin II, Colden's Nomad or Swift's Keewaydin 15.

Better yet would be an Bell Rockstar or Yellowstone Solo, a Colden WildFire or DragonFly, WeNoNah's Cascade, or a Swift Osprey or Raven.

But, with the exception of the Colden's WF & DF and Wenona's C, these are all solo trippers with differential rocker; significantly more bow rocker than Wilderness. They'll all survive class 2 but not play nicely there. The latter three will play in class two and survive class three, depending on the three, and we might add the Super Nova to that group, but a perfect forward stroke is needed to drive them across flatwater, and that would not be a J stroke.

I think OP's performance range is optimistically wide for a single hull.

kanoes has paddled both!! He owns a magic and owned a Wilderness

I have an opinion....but havn't paddled both

SunCatcher

Mark (Frenchy19) has owned and tripped in both, pretty sure he liked the Magic better, at least for BWCA tripping.

quote AndySG: "
Also consider I trip on flat water and rivers up to Class 2 with maybe a few Class 3 spots."

That's easy. You just need more than one boat.

Alan

quote CharlieWilson: "It's difficult to comment without knowing the paddler's height and weight.

Actually, Magic turns more tightly than Wilderness because it has significantly more rocker. It;s flaw in class 2 is that the paddler is sitting, a relatively unstable position compared to kneeling. Most Wilderness paddlers sit as well, so that is not a defining characteristic in choosing between the two.

Folks headed through class 2 water need more bow rocket and are well advised to have fuller quarters. WeNoNah's Argosy would be an improvement as would Bell/NMorthstar's NorthWind Solo, or Merlin II, Colden's Nomad or Swift's Keewaydin 15.

Better yet would be an old Bell Rockstar or Yellowstone solo, a Colden WildFire or DragonFly, WeNoNah's Cascade, or a Swift Osprey or Raven.

"

well said.

quote SunCatcher: "kanoes has paddled both!! He owns a magic and owned a Wilderness


I have an opinion....but havn't paddled both


SunCatcher"

my wilderness was the rx version so I cant really make a comparison to my kev magic. I really did like that wilderness though, wish I would have kept it.

Andy-

I have paddled the Bell Rockstar that CEW mentioned, which is similar to the Wilderness, I think, but with differential rocker. I liked it although my experience with it is flat water. You might want to try one out if you can.

I have owned/tripped with both. The Magic handled like a dream, comparatively, although the Wilderness was more comfortable for me. For some reason I could not get comfy in the Magic; tried 4 different seats with numerous drops and never found a combo where I did not experience some serious discomfort in my groins (insert joke here!). That did not happen with the Wilderness. Never paddled either on white water, and, as both were kevlar, never would have planned on it. I liked fishing out of the Wilderness better as it felt more stable, but it did turn like a pig compared to the Magic.

quote Frenchy19: "I have owned/tripped with both. The Magic handled like a dream, comparatively, although the Wilderness was more comfortable for me. For some reason I could not get comfy in the Magic; tried 4 different seats with numerous drops and never found a combo where I did not experience some serious discomfort
"

Did you have a foot brace? I couldn't stay comfortable in my Magic for long periods of time until I installed one. I can't stand paddling when seated without unless I'm just lazy paddling.

Alan

quote Alan Gage: "

quote Frenchy19: "I have owned/tripped with both. The Magic handled like a dream, comparatively, although the Wilderness was more comfortable for me. For some reason I could not get comfy in the Magic; tried 4 different seats with numerous drops and never found a combo where I did not experience some serious discomfort
"

Did you have a foot brace? I couldn't stay comfortable in my Magic for long periods of time until I installed one. I can't stand paddling when seated without unless I'm just lazy paddling.


Alan"

A funny story about said foot brace...I had one installed by a very reputable builder/canoe repair expert, but when I went to pick up the boat, it appeared to me that the brace was meant for a hobbit. At full extension, my knees were right around the back of my ears. Said builder moved the brace over the winter months, but in the meantime I found a really good deal on an almost brand new Wilderness. Could not afford to keep both, so I went with the Wilderness. In retrospect, I should have given the Magic a chance with the newly placed brace, but my finances are such that I cannot buy at will, and I sold the Magic for the same price I bought it for a couple of years earlier.

quote Frenchy19: "

quote Alan Gage: "

quote Frenchy19: "I have owned/tripped with both. The Magic handled like a dream, comparatively, although the Wilderness was more comfortable for me. For some reason I could not get comfy in the Magic; tried 4 different seats with numerous drops and never found a combo where I did not experience some serious discomfort. "

Did you have a foot brace? I couldn't stay comfortable in my Magic for long periods of time until I installed one. I can't stand paddling when seated without unless I'm just lazy paddling.

Alan"

A funny story about said foot brace...I had one installed by a very reputable builder/canoe repair expert, but when I went to pick up the boat, it appeared to me that the brace was meant for a hobbit. At full extension, my knees were right around the back of my ears. Said builder moved the brace over the winter months, but in the meantime I found a really good deal on an almost brand new Wilderness. Could not afford to keep both, so I went with the Wilderness. In retrospect, I should have given the Magic a chance with the newly placed brace, but my finances are such that I cannot buy at will, and I sold the Magic for the same price I bought it for a couple of years earlier."

Good info Mark. We are similar in size and weight, so your post has some validity. Thanks.

Wilderness Hands down for you Andy SG... :)

It is more stable, more room for YOU, Gear, and loaded will be more stable in rough water for you. You will like it

SunCatcher

quote SunCatcher: "Wilderness Hands down for you Andy SG... :)

It is more stable, more room for YOU, Gear, and loaded will be more stable in rough water for you. You will like it

SunCatcher"

Just don't forget the foot-brace! :-)

Hans Solo

So... Is the space in front of the paddler big enough for a Pioneer Pack (the CCS version)? That is my only problem with some of the smaller solo's for tripping is they get too skinny to fast in front for a decent pack. I like bringing the kitchen sink you know. :)

Might be instructive to try NorthStar/Bell's new NorthWind Solo. 15.5X29.5, differential rocker, available at Midwest Mtn and, I think, Hoigaards in the cities as well as Piragis in Ely and from the factory showroom.

The Black/Gold laminate is superior to the all Kev one, priced accordingly because Kev is ~ $25/lb, carbon $50.

quote CharlieWilson: "Might be instructive to try NorthStar/Bell's new NorthWind Solo. 15.5X29.5, differential rocker, available at Midwest Mtn and, I think, Hoigaards in the cities as well as Piragis in Ely."

I think that is what Bear is putting me in... I'll be posting pictures! I believe I'll be getting a Black/Gold.