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Listening Point - General Discussion

Are You Offended When ........

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LuvMyBell

06/29/2012 09:38AM

I'm not talking about things that are against the rules like burning trash or cutting green wood. I think we are all offended when we see such things.

What I'm talking about are things you that are within the rules but you wouldn't do. An example might be a group of kids making a little more noise (during daylight hours) than you like or someone swimming in your favorite fishing hole that you just spent hours of paddling/portaging to get to.

I must admit that my first reaction to reading "complaints" on this forum is to ask myself if the behavior/action in question is legal and within the written USFWS rules - and not whether I like or agree with the behavior/action. I might be dissapointed at times but I always have the option of moving on.

Paddle Faster....I hear banjo music

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bellolake

06/29/2012 09:53AM

While I seek peace and quiet on my trips, I'm not bothered by reasonable noise from others during the day/early evening. It's their vacation too. I do get annoyed by noise that carries on into the later hours, though not to the point of confronting anyone about it. People swimming or fishing near me may make me wish they would go elsewhere, but they worked just as hard as I did to get there and I hope they are enjoying their visit.

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shoreviewswede

06/29/2012 10:07AM

I cannot say I have. My trips have all been very pleasant.

Be Nice -Swede

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kabloona

06/29/2012 10:14AM

I have very thick bark.... And I deal with the public.
very little offends me.

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missmolly

06/29/2012 10:31AM

I'm not offended if I find someone else on a lake. I just sigh and leave if they plan to stay, but most times, they don't stay. I fish areas where the majority of folks are canoeing through.

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wb4syth

06/29/2012 11:08AM

The closest I get to being offended is when I hear radios - especially one placed out on a rock over the lake so they could listen while swiming (but that was only once).

Other than that, I may shake my head and move on, but I try not to sweat the small stuff anymore.

"I'm not superstitious. I'm a little stitious" - Michael Scott

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The Lorax

06/29/2012 11:32AM

I personally, would never disrupt or in any way take away from someone else's "wilderness experience". While I appreciate the peace and quiet, I do realize that the BWCA does receive almost a quarter of a million visitors a year. If I was that concerned about it, there's plenty of other places I could go to pretty much guarantee that I won't run into that.

I love the smell of silnylon in the morning. It smells like........victory!

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sleepnbag

06/29/2012 11:37AM

It bothers me when you give someone a friendly "Hello" in passing on the portage trail, and they pretend they didn't hear you.
Same goes for on the water giving someone a friendly nod.

"Your Word is a lamp to my feet and a light for my path." Psalm 119:105

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RC123

06/29/2012 11:57AM

I get EXTREMELY upset when I am at a very remote campsite, or a campsite on a huge lake and someone paddles all the way across the lake directly to my campsite and stops to fish 15 feet from the shore in front of the campsite. As if this is the ONLY place in the entire lake where they can fish. And to make it worse they sit and fish for hours and don't catch a damn thing. I have had people come right up to me and start fishing while I am swimming in front of my campsite. This has happened many times to me. I no longer politely tolerate it, I get in my canoe and paddle out and have a little ~chat~ with them.

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Lymphocytosis

06/29/2012 12:31PM

quote sleepnbag: "It bothers me when you give someone a friendly "Hello" in passing on the portage trail, and they pretend they didn't hear you.
Same goes for on the water giving someone a friendly nod."

Could be the person you just passed is a scientist! Practically everyone I pass in the hall if you say "Hi!" just mumbles in response. Not that they're rude, they just are too shy and socially awkward to make an audible reply. lol

Really guilty of that myself until I saw how many people here take that as a sign of truculence. Now I make sure I smile, make eye contact, and say in a strong voice, "Hello!"

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boonie

06/29/2012 02:43PM

quote sleepnbag: "It bothers me when you give someone a friendly "Hello" in passing on the portage trail, and they pretend they didn't hear you.
Same goes for on the water giving someone a friendly nod."

You might think I'm pretending I didn't hear you, but I probably didn't or didn't understand it and thought you were talking to your partner and not me. Some of us are hard of hearing, you know :). Might even be a deaf person wandering around out there.

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BWPaddler

06/29/2012 02:47PM

quote RC123: "I get EXTREMELY upset when I am at a very remote campsite, or a campsite on a huge lake and someone paddles all the way across the lake directly to my campsite and stops to fish 15 feet from the shore in front of the campsite. As if this is the ONLY place in the entire lake where they can fish. And to make it worse they sit and fish for hours and don't catch a damn thing. I have had people come right up to me and start fishing while I am swimming in front of my campsite. This has happened many times to me. I no longer politely tolerate it, I get in my canoe and paddle out and have a little ~chat~ with them."
Hmmmm, did you think to quit wearing the Axe cologne? Maybe then they all wouldn't be attracted to "your" lakeshore... ;)

jk, funny that it happens repeatedly to you, never to me.

Wherever there is a channel for water, there is a road for the canoe. -Thoreau

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boonie

06/29/2012 02:47PM

To answer the original question - I'd say offended is too strong a word, although I'm sometimes annoyed or irritated, but that's true in everyday life too. I avoid a lot of "bugs" by going in Sept :).

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kayakrookie1

06/29/2012 02:51PM

To respond in a generalistic fashion, there are times when I'm offended viscerally by the actions of others even while acknowledging the right of others to do that which offends me. This is where the distinction between approval and tolerance comes into play.

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vickieh69

06/29/2012 02:55PM

quote BWPaddler: "quote RC123: "I get EXTREMELY upset when I am at a very remote campsite, or a campsite on a huge lake and someone paddles all the way across the lake directly to my campsite and stops to fish 15 feet from the shore in front of the campsite. As if this is the ONLY place in the entire lake where they can fish. And to make it worse they sit and fish for hours and don't catch a damn thing. I have had people come right up to me and start fishing while I am swimming in front of my campsite. This has happened many times to me. I no longer politely tolerate it, I get in my canoe and paddle out and have a little ~chat~ with them."
Hmmmm, did you think to quit wearing the Axe cologne? Maybe then they all wouldn't be attracted to "your" lakeshore... ;)

jk, funny that it happens repeatedly to you, never to me."

Too funny BWP

"Nothing exists except atoms and empty space; everything else is opinion." ~Democritus

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Basspro69

06/29/2012 03:28PM

This is the one and only thing i would ever be offended seeing in the Bwca

" I want to know Gods thoughts , The rest are details " Albert Einstein.

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LuvMyBell

06/29/2012 08:52PM

quote RC123: "I get EXTREMELY upset when I am at a very remote campsite, or a campsite on a huge lake and someone paddles all the way across the lake directly to my campsite and stops to fish 15 feet from the shore in front of the campsite. As if this is the ONLY place in the entire lake where they can fish. And to make it worse they sit and fish for hours and don't catch a damn thing. I have had people come right up to me and start fishing while I am swimming in front of my campsite. This has happened many times to me. I no longer politely tolerate it, I get in my canoe and paddle out and have a little ~chat~ with them."

I'd be interested in hearing what you say in your "chat". Of the scenarios you mentioned I think I'd only have an issue if I were swimming , whether at my campsite or not, and fisherman started throwing their line right where I was swimming.Aside from the fact that this is somewhat dangerous and rude, they aren't likely to catch many fish while someone is splashing around in the water.

Thankfully I've never had this experience.

Paddle Faster....I hear banjo music

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Sierra1

06/29/2012 09:03PM

quote Basspro69: "This is the one and only thing i would ever be offended seeing in the Bwca "

LOL!!!

Watch out for that rock!!!........ Oooo.... That's going to leave a mark...

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jwartman59

06/29/2012 09:41PM

we were winter camping on clearwater lake, two Texans (we asked) pulled into our campsite on their snowmobiles. I was offended. they got a good dose of Minnesota 'not at all' nice.

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gutmon

06/29/2012 09:56PM

I slept with a rock under my hip once.

"The trouble with the world isn't that people know too little, but that they know so much that just ain't so." Mark Twain

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timatkn

06/29/2012 11:44PM

quote RC123: "I get EXTREMELY upset when I am at a very remote campsite, or a campsite on a huge lake and someone paddles all the way across the lake directly to my campsite and stops to fish 15 feet from the shore in front of the campsite. As if this is the ONLY place in the entire lake where they can fish. And to make it worse they sit and fish for hours and don't catch a damn thing. I have had people come right up to me and start fishing while I am swimming in front of my campsite. This has happened many times to me. I no longer politely tolerate it, I get in my canoe and paddle out and have a little ~chat~ with them."

A buddy of mine had that happen to him, so he loaded up the kids and fished right off of their camp. It freaked the other group out as they vacatesd his site and went back to their site. Best part was he started nailing walleyes in front of their camp :)

T

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Minnesotian

06/30/2012 09:19AM

quote boonie: Might even be a deaf person wandering around out there."

This has happened to me once before. I was taking the 280 portage from Beth to Grace. I was carrying some packs and came across this lady who stood off to the side of the trail. I stopped, said hello, and proceeded to ask her how the rest of the trail was and she looked at me and started signing and shaking her head no. Oh, I said, and then gave a friendly wave and carried on.

"We should go forth on the shortest walk, perchance in the spirit of undying adventure, never to return - prepared to send back our embalmed hearts only as relics to our desolate kingdom." - Thoreau

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oldgentleman

06/30/2012 11:33AM

quote boonie:

You might think I'm pretending I didn't hear you, but I probably didn't or didn't understand it and thought you were talking to your partner and not me. Some of us are hard of hearing, you know :). Might even be a deaf person wandering around out there."

I'm not deaf, exactly, but I don't hear very well. Knowing that, when I meet somebody on a portage I look toward them with a nod, smile, hello etc. Then I can see a response even if I don't hear it.

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AdamXChicago

06/30/2012 11:34AM

quote boonie: "To answer the original question - I'd say offended is too strong a word, although I'm sometimes annoyed or irritated, but that's true in everyday life too. I avoid a lot of "bugs" by going in Sept :)."

What Boonie said

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MrBreeze

07/03/2012 02:49PM

Only one time did I really get upset with people in the BW. We were in camp and had five different groups come up one morning asking if we were leaving soon. As if the upside down canoes on the shore and food pack hanging in the tree was not enough sign. There were 6 campsites on this lake and two were still open yet they kept paddling up and asking. My friend finally made a big sign out of a life jacket that said OCCUPIED and put it up on the shoreline.

It was a nice site but not that nice that everyone would want it over the others.

Other than that I have usually had great interactions with my fellow paddlers.

I wish I were, I wish I might, I wish I was in the BWCA tonite!

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inspector13

07/03/2012 03:27PM

Offended no, but mildly irritated by Tarzan like calls and fake wolf calls. What’s with that?

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Jackfish

Moderator

07/03/2012 03:33PM

quote Basspro69: "This is the one and only thing i would ever be offended seeing in the Bwca "
Brad, you're killing me here! LOLOLOLOL Aren't you glad Packer Backers don't have to put up with seeing Vikings players holding that trophy? :)

It's only a spot on the map... until you go there.

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Ingvald

07/03/2012 04:08PM

quote inspector13: "
Offended no, but mildly irritated by Tarzan like calls and fake wolf calls. What’s with that?

"
Are you saying Bobo and Matt Moneymaker set up camp next to you?

Honesty is my only excuse.

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SevenofNine

07/03/2012 04:19PM

quote inspector13: "
Offended no, but mildly irritated by Tarzan like calls and fake wolf calls. What’s with that?
"

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!

AAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!

The amount of satisfaction you get from life depends largely on your own ingenuity, self-sufficiency, and resourcefulness. People who wait around for life to supply their satisfaction usually find boredom instead.

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schweady

07/03/2012 09:17PM

quote inspector13: "
Offended no, but mildly irritated by Tarzan like calls and fake wolf calls. What’s with that?

"
Yup. With all of the other things that could upset a person, it's goofballs who think they can do a really realistic loon call that are like nails on the blackboard for me. Nope. Not even close, bud.

"You can observe a lot by watching." -- Yogi Berra

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bhouse46

07/03/2012 11:01PM

Knowing sound travels over water I have made great effort to restrict my sounds, even the old aluminum scrape at docking, as part of the LNT concepts. At times my spirit calls for me to cry out, often in a chant like rhythm that paces my paddle and I have been comfortable chatting with the animals I encounter. As I age the tones are softer and muted, not the attention seeking cry of youth. One of the benefits of going solo into remote areas is how the spirit gets stronger.
Mostly others celebrating their way is okay when they adhere to LNT but anything beyond that is annoying. I correct where reasonable and chose not to let it ruin my trip following the tenets of the serenity prayer.

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Corsair

07/04/2012 10:04AM

quote sleepnbag: "It bothers me when you give someone a friendly "Hello" in passing on the portage trail, and they pretend they didn't hear you.
Same goes for on the water giving someone a friendly nod."

I couldn't agree more!

AT MINIMAL SMILE AND NOD! And if they can't see you they shouldn't be out there!

Oh also dirty looks are very offensive when all I did was smile and say hello.

"Pack lightly, Tread lightly"

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Basspro69

07/04/2012 10:31AM

quote Jackfish: "quote Basspro69: "This is the one and only thing i would ever be offended seeing in the Bwca "
Brad, you're killing me here! LOLOLOLOL Aren't you glad Packer Backers don't have to put up with seeing Vikings players holding that trophy? :)" I think Packer Fans have no fear of seeing the Vikes holding that trophy anytime soon :-0

" I want to know Gods thoughts , The rest are details " Albert Einstein.

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LuvMyBell

07/04/2012 10:37AM

quote Corsair: "quote sleepnbag: "It bothers me when you give someone a friendly "Hello" in passing on the portage trail, and they pretend they didn't hear you.
Same goes for on the water giving someone a friendly nod."

I couldn't agree more!

AT MINIMAL SMILE AND NOD! And if they can't see you they shouldn't be out there!

Oh also dirty looks are very offensive when all I did was smile and say hello."

Isn't diversity grand???????

Paddle Faster....I hear banjo music

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HikingStick

07/05/2012 09:41AM

quote sleepnbag: "It bothers me when you give someone a friendly "Hello" in passing on the portage trail, and they pretend they didn't hear you.
Same goes for on the water giving someone a friendly nod."
It might not be that they didn't hear you. On my first trip in after many, many years away, some of those portages pushed me to my limit. I heard some folks say "Hi," and wanted to respond, but was just fighting to stay upright and to catch my breath after a long uphill climb.

On behalf of any who have not replied to your greetings, I apologize. Do realize that there might be more than one reason why someone may not respond (like a couple that just had an argument before they reached the portage landing [could hear them from the other side of it], and obviously wasn't interested in exchanging civilities on the trail).

“If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.” ? J.R.R. Tolkien, The Hobbit

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Rapid Runner

07/05/2012 10:32AM

quote RC123: "I get EXTREMELY upset when I am at a very remote campsite, or a campsite on a huge lake and someone paddles all the way across the lake directly to my campsite and stops to fish 15 feet from the shore in front of the campsite. As if this is the ONLY place in the entire lake where they can fish. And to make it worse they sit and fish for hours and don't catch a damn thing. I have had people come right up to me and start fishing while I am swimming in front of my campsite. This has happened many times to me. I no longer politely tolerate it, I get in my canoe and paddle out and have a little ~chat~ with them."

i would love to be on the other end of this ~chat~. I think i would upset the rest of the lake with laughter. if you get EXTREMELY upset over someone fishing to close to you in a lake neither of you own. i bet your blood pressure during traffic jams looks like the thermometer outside right now at 105F.

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Rapid Runner

07/05/2012 10:44AM

i would get offended when people get mad at me for doing something legal, but they dont like it, so they feel the need to disrupt me and tell me how they feel.

If what your doing is legal i dont have a problem with it and wont be offended by it. i dont care if you across the lake playing stairway to heaven on a harmonica at 2 am. i have ear plugs if i dont want to listen to it ill put them in.

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Spartan2

07/05/2012 12:05PM

I can't say I was ever "offended" by anything in the canoe country.

Annoyed, yes. But annoyed enough to say anything, no.

Annoyed one time on Gaskin Lake when a man across the lake kept howling at the full moon, then laughing heartily. Once or twice would have been OK, probably, but it went on and on. Annoyed.

Annoyed on our last trip when our "neighbors" at the only other campsite on the lake decided to party hearty at 1:30 A. M. Annoyed enough to put my ear plugs back in and pull my pillow over my head and try to get back to sleep.

And I, too, become annoyed when someone fishes for hours right off the landing of our campsite, especially if I was planning on swimming. But I never say anything, I just wait them out, or decide not to swim.

I figure I am probably annoying, too. I am slow on portages because of pain and balance issues. There might have been times when I made a bit more noise than I should have, too. Maybe we paddled too close to a fisherman when we were on our way sometime. It happens. When you are around people, sometimes you annoy them.

But offended? Nope. Can't think of being actually offended. When I get up there, I am just so happy to be there, and so involved in doing what I have to do to make it work, to take my photos, to make my trip. . . .nothing much that is "legal" offends me. :-)

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wb4syth

07/06/2012 08:04AM

quote Rapid Runner: "quote RC123: "I get EXTREMELY upset when I am at a very remote campsite, or a campsite on a huge lake and someone paddles all the way across the lake directly to my campsite and stops to fish 15 feet from the shore in front of the campsite. As if this is the ONLY place in the entire lake where they can fish. And to make it worse they sit and fish for hours and don't catch a damn thing. I have had people come right up to me and start fishing while I am swimming in front of my campsite. This has happened many times to me. I no longer politely tolerate it, I get in my canoe and paddle out and have a little ~chat~ with them."

i would love to be on the other end of this ~chat~. I think i would upset the rest of the lake with laughter. if you get EXTREMELY upset over someone fishing to close to you in a lake neither of you own. i bet your blood pressure during traffic jams looks like the thermometer outside right now at 105F. "

I hear you RC123 - every body of water has its own personal space capacity. When I am on Mille Lacs or Tonka I expect bumper boats (and don't really mind it if they aren't being idiots). When I am in the BW I want to get away from that and would find it pretty annoying to have someone anchored up right in front of my camp.
In the past I have asked "creepers" if they want me to bait their hook for them too. They usually get the hint.

"I'm not superstitious. I'm a little stitious" - Michael Scott

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missmolly

07/06/2012 08:51AM

If someone fished in front of my campsite, I'd be offended by their stupidity. When I'm at camp, I often pick up a rod and cast. The spot in front of my campsite is the most fished part of the entire lake.

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LuvMyBell

07/06/2012 10:45AM

quote missmolly: "If someone fished in front of my campsite, I'd be offended by their stupidity. When I'm at camp, I often pick up a rod and cast. The spot in front of my campsite is the most fished part of the entire lake. "

I can't imagine anyone anchoring right in front (just offshore) of an occupied campsite, especially if the occupiers are in camp at the time.

What is a respectable distance - 20 yards, 50 yards, 100 yards? Do you have have the same issue with someone drifting by and not actually stopping?

I haven't found many campsites where the fishing was great standing on the shoreline - a few but not many. When I fish I get in my canoe and paddle out or over to a good spot.

I've been in camp and have been able to "see' people fishing but they have always been what I'd consider a respectable distance away from the shoreline the closer they are to a designated campsite.

Paddle Faster....I hear banjo music

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Rapid Runner

07/06/2012 11:12AM

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missmolly

07/06/2012 11:30AM

quote LuvMyBell: "quote missmolly: "If someone fished in front of my campsite, I'd be offended by their stupidity. When I'm at camp, I often pick up a rod and cast. The spot in front of my campsite is the most fished part of the entire lake. "

I can't imagine anyone anchoring right in front (just offshore) of an occupied campsite, especially if the occupiers are in camp at the time.

What is a respectable distance - 20 yards, 50 yards, 100 yards? Do you have have the same issue with someone drifting by and not actually stopping?

I haven't found many campsites where the fishing was great standing on the shoreline - a few but not many. When I fish I get in my canoe and paddle out or over to a good spot.

I've been in camp and have been able to "see' people fishing but they have always been what I'd consider a respectable distance away from the shoreline the closer they are to a designated campsite.

"

Luvmybell, most of what I write is for funnin'. On the serious side, I've never had anyone fish in front of my campsite. I might see one other canoe in a typical week. I might see a canoe where the paddlers are fishing once every four or five months. The chance that they'll paddle by my campsite is slight. The chance that they'd stop to fish is nearly non-existent. Why would they fish there when they've got the whole lake? However, if they did, I'd consider them a kook because they're fishing a spot I might have fished a mere ten minutes ago. They could do it and I'd sit on the shore, watch them, and scratch my head. I might even photograph them since they'd be a rarer sight than a bobcat.

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LuvMyBell

07/06/2012 11:42AM

quote missmolly: "quote LuvMyBell: "quote missmolly: "If someone fished in front of my campsite, I'd be offended by their stupidity. When I'm at camp, I often pick up a rod and cast. The spot in front of my campsite is the most fished part of the entire lake. "

I can't imagine anyone anchoring right in front (just offshore) of an occupied campsite, especially if the occupiers are in camp at the time.

What is a respectable distance - 20 yards, 50 yards, 100 yards? Do you have have the same issue with someone drifting by and not actually stopping?

I haven't found many campsites where the fishing was great standing on the shoreline - a few but not many. When I fish I get in my canoe and paddle out or over to a good spot.

I've been in camp and have been able to "see' people fishing but they have always been what I'd consider a respectable distance away from the shoreline the closer they are to a designated campsite.

"

Luvmybell, most of what I write is for funnin'. On the serious side, I've never had anyone fish in front of my campsite. I might see one other canoe in a typical week. I might see a canoe where the paddlers are fishing once every four or five months. The chance that they'll paddle by my campsite is slight. The chance that they'd stop to fish is nearly non-existant. Why would they fish there when they've got the whole lake? However, if they did, I'd consider them a kook because they're fishing a spot I might have fished a mere ten minutes ago. They could do it and I'd sit on the shore, watch them, and scratch my head. I might even photograph them since they'd be a rarer sight than a bobcat."

That's been my experience too - NEVER HAPPENED. My 'what is a respectable distance' question should have been addressed to those that have had this happen.

Paddle Faster....I hear banjo music

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schweady

07/06/2012 01:51PM

We were very happy to have a guy paddle over and catch some walleye right in by our campsite on our last full day of base camping on Bald Eagle. Prior that, we had (of course) been trying every other spot on the lake and in Gabbro, with limited success. Saved us a lot of travel and search time, and those fillets were mighty tasty that night, too!

"You can observe a lot by watching." -- Yogi Berra

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keth0601

07/06/2012 02:31PM

Can't say I've ever actually been offended in the BWCA. I've been mildly irritated before, especially with people that do not have good portage etiquette (not illegal), but nothing that would really stick in my memory as a negative experience.

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Goby

07/06/2012 02:49PM

I get annoyed when people don't follow portage etiquitte. I got very annoyed, but didn't say anything, when a guy put on bug spray at the start of a portage and I was behind him grabbing a pack and thus got a nice dose in the mouth. Other than that I haven't had any issue. Its annoying to find trash at campsites too, but I clean that up and go on my merry way. It would take a lot to make me get overly upset up there, though I do give credit to an ex girlfriend for trying her darnedest :P

Tight Lines

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