BWCA Can't Find A Campsite -- What would you do?? Boundary Waters Listening Point


BWCA Messageboard

BWCA and Quetico Park Books and Magazines

Find Outfitters for the Boundary Waters Quetico

Boundary Waters (BWCA) photo gallery and individual photo journals

Boundary Waters Message Board and Forums.

username

password

Remember Me

Kawishiwi Lodge and Lake One Outfitting
Site Search
	Contact Us
	Route Guide

Chat Rooms (2 Chatting) | Search | Login/Join

* For the benefit of the community, commercial posting is not allowed.

View BWCA Photo and Trip Report Contest Page

Poll: What is your favorite month in the BWCA/Q?
(471 responses)

2012 BWCA Photo Contest Results

Boundary Waters Quetico Forum

Listening Point - General Discussion

Can't Find A Campsite -- What would you do??

View Boundary Waters Map Locations

Route Guide

community sponsor

Sawbill Canoe Outfitters

Last Visit: 05/21/2013 02:13PM
Sort by

Author

Message Text

dprochef

06/17/2012 09:51PM

Just got back from a week long trip through EP #30. I usually won't trip during peak season (Memorial Day - Labor Day) for this very reason.

On Day one of our trip we set out at our normal leisurely time of 2-3pm. We start out down the Kawishiwi River, away from the popular Number Lakes. There are five of us - Myself, Dad, Brother and his two kids 6 & 9. As we paddle and portage we notice ALL campsites are full. As the day goes on we start getting a little nervous of finding a campsite before sunset. Thank goodness that it wasn't really getting dark until after 9:30pm.

Well we finally found a campsite at about 8pm. We were really getting nervous with the kids and all. So we starting talking, "what would you do if you couldn't find a regulated campsite, and it was getting late in the day (towards sunset), would you find a suitable place and make a makeshift campsite"

Knowing fully that it was against the rules, but following as many as possible ( human waste buried 100+ feet away from water, no campfires (stove only))

WHAT WOULD YOU DO.

Courage is being scared to death... but saddling up anyway....John Wayne

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

campnscrap

06/17/2012 10:47PM

keep on padding

THE EDGE, there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over. - Hunter S. Thompson

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

fitgers1

06/17/2012 10:51PM

If it is going to be dark (no moon), I would set up a makeshift camp, tent only and get up very early and continue on.
If it was a full moon night with a lot of light, I would keep going for a couple hours after sunset and hope I would find a site. If no site, I would set up the tent somewhere and get up early and continue on.

“What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.” Ralph Waldo Emerson...and...“Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading".

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

TeamTuna06

06/17/2012 10:54PM

I'd start earlier...in the event that everything was taken, I'd keep paddling/looking.

"If people concentrated on the really important things in life, there’d be a shortage of fishing poles." -Doug Larson

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

gopher2307

06/17/2012 10:57PM

I'd pull over and set up a camp, but I'd wait/paddle until (by your example) after 9 or so. Interesting question. I think it is fair to say that you have legitimate safety concerns about paddling/portaging at night with children, which should supersede any rules geared towards conservation of wilderness.
To that point, I think your safety concerns dissipate at sunrise the next morning. So you would need to pick up and move out right away.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

nojobro

06/17/2012 11:06PM

This is one reason we switched our 2012 plans away from EP 30. Before the fire we were going to do EP 30 and head to the Kawishiwi area, but I figured it would be extra crowded this year because of people still going in at ep30 but going away from the burned areas. I have kids, too, and with the little one being only four, I don't really feel like I can risk not finding something or having to canoe for hours more than planned if I could at all help it.

I think I lean more toward asking someone to share their site than making our own camp. Going on and on looking for our own site leaves little to be desired with the kids along, though before we'd ask if someone could share or we made our own site, I know we'd be paddled out already. I bet it would be difficult for us to make our own site as our tent is rather big (fits the four of us and our dog).

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

nofish

06/17/2012 11:28PM

With a group of 5 I wouldn't expect a group to share their site. With 5 people you'd need probably 2 tents and and with a group already there you'd probably be hard pressed to find room for 2 more tents on most sites.

In your situation I'd have probably paddled as long as possible in hopes of finding a site and then I'd have bushwhacked a site as best as possible and made sure to get up and moving very early the next morning.

Really the best thing to do is to get on the water much earlier than 2-3pm. Its even more important when you know you are going to be traveling through a busy area. I'm not at all surprised you had a hard time finding a site in that area. Normally my goal is to have camp set by 2pm, not starting my day at 2pm.

I was on one trip years ago that was led by a friend of mine and no matter what I did I could not get this guy moving earlier than maybe noon or 1pm everyday. No surprise that we had a really hard time finding sites that entire trip, never again will I do that.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

dprochef

06/17/2012 11:36PM

I would agree with Campnscrap, Fitgers1, and teamTuna06 if I were solo paddling. But with a 70yr old (fairly good condition)6 & 9 yr old I don't think i would (or could in good judgement) keep paddling after dark, thus endangering them. If it were just the boys, that may be different.

But with the situation as it were, how could you justify paddling at dark even in a full moon, One brush against a rock in the middle of the lake and now you and your gear is in the lake.

So seriously, What would you do.

Courage is being scared to death... but saddling up anyway....John Wayne

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

Ragged

06/18/2012 12:01AM

quote fitgers1: "If it is going to be dark (no moon), I would set up a makeshift camp, tent only and get up very early and continue on.
If it was a full moon night with a lot of light, I would keep going for a couple hours after sunset and hope I would find a site. If no site, I would set up the tent somewhere and get up early and continue on."

What he said

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

Sierra1

06/18/2012 06:55AM

Find a spot and camp for the night. It's not like your setting up permanent (i.e. - basecamp) arrangements as you will leave as soon as possible in the morning. Don't make a fire, use the stove to cook and clean up after yourself (LNT). Paddling at night looking for an empty campsite can be dangerous.

Watch out for that rock!!!........ Oooo.... That's going to leave a mark...

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

Craig K

06/18/2012 07:13AM

Were the kids 6&9 or 3&6?

Planning is the key! With a group that I didn't have full confidence in paddle after dark, I would have made a camp if needed. -Only one trip did I paddle after dark and that was a planned late entry with a group of very able paddlers. all other trips we have made a morning entry to make sure we had a site by early afternoon.

But to answer your question: with your group in that circumstance I would have made a camp at dusk somewhere if one hadn't been located yet.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

PineKnot

06/18/2012 07:33AM

Scrape out an area for the tents. Depart the next morning and try to leave no trace.

Do what you can, with what you have, where you are -- Teddy Roosevelt

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

520eek

06/18/2012 07:37AM

Should have started out much earlier for that very reason.

I have a lot on my mind....but not much in my mind!

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

DayDreamin

06/18/2012 07:40AM

quote 520eek: "Should have started out much earlier for that very reason. "

I agree 100%. But in the situation in question, I would use a makeshift site, and be off at first light, and practice LNT as Sierra1 suggested.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

Harv

06/18/2012 11:40AM

Make a camp for the night

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

mjmkjun

06/18/2012 12:05PM

a makeshift camp if nothing found before nightfall. it's not like you're a group of yahoos tryng to challenge the rules. you've got kids to consider/to teach how to apply common sense.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

salukiguy

06/18/2012 12:10PM

How was the campsite availability for the remainder of the trip? Did you get earlier starts on the other days?

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

Canoearoo

06/18/2012 12:47PM

quote 520eek: "Should have started out much earlier for that very reason. "

this

with kids you havresponsibilitylity to maintain there safety. And for that reason we always are on the water by 9am and make camp by 2-3pm

Life jackets float, you don't!

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

GeoFisher

06/18/2012 01:40PM

quote campnscrap: "keep on padding
"

I agree........PUSH on. We ended up on Horse lake well past 6:00pm, and there were not sites available. We ended up pushing into fourtown and took the first campsite we found. It was a pretty big site, with plenty of room, and next to running water, so it was a pretty peaceful sleep.

I wished we had time to fish fourtown or explore it a little, but we got in so late, and I was bushed........

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

Savage Voyageur

06/18/2012 01:52PM

This is why I move early in the day and try to be in camp by noon or 2 pm. To answer the question I would try to find a spot to camp in the woods. I was in a PMA area last week and saw areas where old sites were or a point where people have stopped and camped. Looked like any other regular campsite.

"So many lakes, so little time."

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

dprochef

06/18/2012 05:48PM

Thanks for all the comments. We decided that if we were unable to, we would have had to make camp just before sunset and stove cook, LNT, and pull out first thing in the morning. Luckily we didn't have to.

For those that stated that we should have planned better and left earlier. Well, we did plan our trip thoroughly, This is not our first trip, we have made over Three dozen trips between the three adults. Not all people have the ability to start first thing in the morning. It's a 11+ hour drive for us to get to the BWCA with pit stops and lunch breaks. We split up our drive by overnighting in St. Paul and heading up to Ely first thing in the morning.

As always, I always enjoys all the different views to the questions here, and respect everyone's opinions. And as I say "If you can't handle the Answer...Don't ask the question"

Courage is being scared to death... but saddling up anyway....John Wayne

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

Spartan2

06/18/2012 06:34PM

At some point if it is getting too late, we would find a place to make a camp. We would put up a tent (there are only two of us, but if necessary, for a group of five, I guess put up two tents.) We would NOT cook, we would eat cold food. We would carefully bury waste, and leave no trace. We would leave VERY early in the morning, as soon after first light as possible, and after a cold breakfast. No stove, no fire. That is what we would do.

Because we travel 700+ miles to the canoe country, we always have stayed in a motel, bunkhouse, B&B, or campground the night before a trip and we get an early morning start. We have never started a trip in the afternoon. But we have experienced the feeling of not finding a campsite until late in the day and it gives me a panicky feeling. We have only once ever made an unauthorized campsite, and if we had to do it again, we would do what I described above.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

yellowcanoe

06/18/2012 06:46PM

quote dprochef: "Thanks for all the comments. We decided that if we were unable to, we would have had to make camp just before sunset and stove cook, LNT, and pull out first thing in the morning. Luckily we didn't have to.

For those that stated that we should have planned better and left earlier. Well, we did plan our trip thoroughly, This is not our first trip, we have made over Three dozen trips between the three adults. Not all people have the ability to start first thing in the morning. It's a 11+ hour drive for us to get to the BWCA with pit stops and lunch breaks. We split up our drive by overnighting in St. Paul and heading up to Ely first thing in the morning.

As always, I always enjoys all the different views to the questions here, and respect everyone's opinions. And as I say "If you can't handle the Answer...Don't ask the question" "

Our answers were probably meant for the vast majority of readers that just start late each day and wind up in a crunch and does not refer necessarily to put in day. Or to newbies who might not be aware what they are getting into. Not all of the responses may have been directed at you.

Scheduling problems always get one in a bind. Its not easy when you are working and trying to maximize camping days. You just do the best you can.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

oldgentleman

06/18/2012 09:37PM

Like Spartan2, we travel from Michigan, a 12 to 14 hour drive. We arrive the day before and spend the night at Voyageur North Bunkhouse (plug there for Lynn & John) and get on the water before sunrise.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

brp

06/18/2012 11:34PM

Does starting early really address this problem? If they started earlier, it would have just been another group looking for the site.

I understand how more time could give everyone more time to disperse, but if you can't reach the end of the populated area by nightfall, it is a non-point. (Example, you go in Lake One on a Sat AM and a bunch of groups came in Th. and Fri, took the sites on 1, 2, 3 and are not moving)

Seems more like a quota issue, but I could be wrong.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

nofish

06/19/2012 12:04AM

Quota or no quota I think planning a trip where you are relying on finding an open site after 3 pm in a popular area is asking for trouble.

Since their group was likely the last to enter that day it seems to me the quota was just about right since they did end up finding a site within the first couple hours of traveling. They just didn't leave themselves any safety cushion in case there was a problem finding a site. Had they been on the water by 9am they'd have found that site early in the afternoon with plenty of time left to travel on if they had to.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

VoyageurNorth

06/19/2012 12:48AM

quote oldgentleman: "Like Spartan2, we travel from Michigan, a 12 to 14 hour drive. We arrive the day before and spend the night at Voyageur North Bunkhouse (plug there for Lynn & John) and get on the water before sunrise."

Thanks & we enjoy having you "visit" with us too.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

Beaverjack

06/19/2012 05:28AM

I wonder what the population density of the average lake shore is on a summer day in the BW. Probably not much different than your average suburban neighborhood.

Tony

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

oldgentleman

06/19/2012 06:34AM

quote brp: "Does starting early really address this problem? If they started earlier, it would have just been another group looking for the site.

Seems more like a quota issue, but I could be wrong. "

A lot of people move in the morning. They leave a site and don't start looking to camp for several hours. This happens all over, so more sites are open before another one is taken.

If you get on the water early you can start looking for a site by noon or so. You have a lot more time to find an acceptable camp.

The population density gets thinner the further you get from the EP, so if you have time to paddle longer you're more likely to find open sites and leave an opening at your previous camp.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

CrookedPaddler1

06/19/2012 09:45AM

To quote a forest service employee to a party of mine when i was outfitting "poor planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine". In other words, you need to get up and moving in the morning, and plan on finding a campsite with plenty of daylight left. If you can't find one, then (according to the FS) you need to keep moving, regardless of whether it is dark or not.

Now at the same time, I would probably stop, cook dinner on a point somewhere (using a stove), take a break so that we are not putting anyone at a huge risk due to being tired, and then hit the next portage.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

TuscaroraBorealis

06/19/2012 09:54AM

It seems that this thread has been giving more answers on how to avoid this dilema, than actually answering the original question?

Certainly getting a early start and having a good game plan are crucial elements to avoiding this problem. But, every once in awhile life has a way of altering the best laid plans. Regardless of how skilled or prepared we think we are.

Maybe I'm wrong here?

But, I don't believe the intent of the original question was meant to lambast anyone who gave an answer that doesn't comply with Forest Service regulations? Or to imply they're bad planners & don't have the skill set required to travel through the wilderness. More, to explore what options might be out there when a person does find themselves between a rock & a hard place.

Of course there are alot of variables that would go into making this conclusion. Personally, I would camp anywhere that would reasonably work versus paddling through the night or any hazzardous conditions. Simply put, not getting a fine will never trump safety in my book.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

shoreviewswede

06/19/2012 10:07AM

Mistake already made, I'd stay safe. I would not paddle at night with canoes loaded. I'd look for a place to pitch a tent with as little impact as possible, with no fire and an early exit.

Be Nice -Swede

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

Trix

06/19/2012 10:29AM

quote TuscaroraBorealis: "It seems that this thread has been giving more answers on how to avoid this dilema, than actually answering the original question?

Certainly getting a early start and having a good game plan are crucial elements to avoiding this problem. But, every once in awhile life has a way of altering the best laid plans. Regardless of how skilled or prepared we think we are.

Maybe I'm wrong here?

But, I don't believe the intent of the original question was meant to lambast anyone who gave an answer that doesn't comply with Forest Service regulations? Or to imply they're are bad planners & don't have the skill set required to travel through the wilderness. More, to explore what options might be out there when a person does find themselves between a rock & a hard place.

Of course there are alot of variables that would go into making this conclusion. Personally, I would camp anywhere that would reasonably work versus paddling through the night or any hazzardous conditions. Simply put, not getting a fine will never trump safety in my book. "

Well Said Paul!

C-H-A-L-L-E-N-G-E: Do not let what you cannot do, interfere with what you can do.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

Minnesotian

06/19/2012 10:32AM

I would keep on paddling...if I was feeling comfortable with the situation at the time. For example, if it was a calm night, warm, etc.

If there was a wind up, or looked stormy, or whatever, then I would be making camp at the first good place I could find and leave at the crack of dawn.

"We should go forth on the shortest walk, perchance in the spirit of undying adventure, never to return - prepared to send back our embalmed hearts only as relics to our desolate kingdom." - Thoreau

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

mooseplums

06/19/2012 03:23PM

quote shoreviewswede: "Mistake already made, I'd stay safe. I would not paddle at night with canoes loaded. I'd look for a place to pitch a tent with as little impact as possible, with no fire and an early exit."

Exactly...."Crash the woods" to quote someone on here :)

"I am haunted by waters"~Norman Maclean "A River Runs Through It"

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

Grandma L

06/19/2012 03:46PM

Safety First!!

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

bwcadan

06/19/2012 09:31PM

Getting out at the crack of dawn should not be a problem as all will be awake anyway.

the greatest come backs are reserved for those with the greatest deficits.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

blackdawg9

06/19/2012 10:22PM

i guess if i couldn't find a empty site. i would of stayed at a safe place . kept set up to a minimum . maybe just a stove to boil water. i guess if it looked like maybe the last camp site and the occupants were few. i would paddle over and ask if we could pitch there with them and be on our way first thing in the morning. we had a site several years back at the mouth of a 3 1/2 mile portage one way. they're was a single couple we invited in to stay the night, they accepted our offer. we were up early to portage too, but they were already gone. we caught up with them on the other end of the trail and they were much appreciative.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

kanoes

06/19/2012 10:44PM

quote blackdawg9: "we had a site several years back at the mouth of a 3 1/2 mile portage one way."
what portage?

i think bigfoot is blurry. (mitch hedberg)

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

blackdawg9

06/19/2012 10:47PM

quote kanoes: "quote blackdawg9: "we had a site several years back at the mouth of a 3 1/2 mile portage one way."
what portage?" algonquin north east ontario. it's called the bonfield dixon. i can't remeber the name of the main lake might be lavielle.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

kanoes

06/19/2012 10:49PM

thanks. ill research that now.

i think bigfoot is blurry. (mitch hedberg)

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

blackdawg9

06/19/2012 10:56PM

quote kanoes: "thanks. ill research that now." http://www.doe.carleton.ca/~ngt/algonquin/opeongo/opeongo_frames.html

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

blackdawg9

06/19/2012 11:04PM

these were some pics someone else posted of the same area.

Reply Reply with Quote Print Top Bottom Previous Next

BWCA Messageboard