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Skid Plates ???

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- Canoe Gear and Repair

Last Visit: 05/22/2013 08:00PM
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Kendra

03/18/2010 07:47AM

Internal vs. external? What are the advantages/disadvantages of either type of skid plate?

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Banksiana

03/18/2010 09:58AM

Internal are great because they do not alter the shape and performance of the canoe. They must be "installed" during the manufacturing process.

For external plates I build my own by addling two to three strips of glass to the bow and stern of the canoe- not as durable as the commercial plates, but cheaper and better for maintaining the shape and performance of the canoe.

Good commercial skid plates and installation instructions here:
NW canoe plates

Steal a little and they throw you in jail. Steal a lot and they make you king.

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Cedarboy

03/18/2010 10:15AM

An internal skid plate seems to be an "oximoron" to me. Since the purpose is adding another wear layer to the canoe. Kind of hard to add another wear layer to the "inside" of canoe. I put my skids on after the stems have gotten beatup a little. No real need until then, IMO. There are different sizes of skids you can apply depending on solo, tandem or river/royalex/whitewater. Northwest Canoe has some great info and prices AND install pics for DIY.
CB

Not affiliated just a happy customer!

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moose plums

03/18/2010 10:42AM

quote Cedarboy: "An internal skid plate seems to be an "oximoron" to me. Since the purpose is adding another wear layer to the canoe. Kind of hard to add another wear layer to the "inside" of canoe. I put my skids on after the stems have gotten beatup a little. No real need until then, IMO. There are different sizes of skids you can apply depending on solo, tandem or river/royalex/whitewater. Northwest Canoe has some great info and prices AND install pics for DIY.
CB

Not affiliated just a happy customer!"

I agree with Cedarboy on NW Canoe. they do great work that is affordable.

Neither of my canoes have skids on them now and won't until I see noticeable wear.

"I am haunted by waters"~Norman Maclean "A River Runs Through It"

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Old Scout

Guest Paddler

03/18/2010 11:04AM

Another option to kevlar skid plates.

I have a solo canoe that came with a rolled on epoxy / graphite powder skid layer on the bow and stern.

I have had to redo them a couple of times over the last 7 years, but it does work.

It is simply a layer of epoxy and graphite powder that I roll on with a foam roller. The graphite powder makes the skid area a nice black color and it doesn't change the performance of the canoe. The skid area extends down under the bow and stern about 12" on the bottom of the canoe and up the stem area (about 2" on either side) to the gunwales.

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amhacker22@hotmail.com

03/18/2010 11:28AM

I just put a pair of NW Canoe skids on this weekend. I don't think it took more than 1/2 hour of work. Totally worth the time and money.

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cowdoc

03/18/2010 03:09PM

A cheaper alternative that I use is a thin layer a felt. It's easy to work with to cut out your pattern and it soaks up epoxy well. I haven't wore a pair out yet. They can be a bit bulkier, but they sand down nice. I actually colored the epoxy mix with some paint so the skids would be less noticeable on my Mad River.

"What could happen?"

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Kendra

03/18/2010 03:31PM

Nice job on the canoe cowdoc. Who would have thought of felt?

P.S- Nice maps too! They aren't going anywhere are they. Gotta love that DT!

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moose plums

03/18/2010 03:45PM

yeah Doc nice job! I'll come over to Brodhead so we can do mine:) I'll try to score some homebrews from Mr, Barley.

"I am haunted by waters"~Norman Maclean "A River Runs Through It"

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cowdoc

03/18/2010 04:24PM

Bring it down MP....and you can visit the elephant again while you're here........

"What could happen?"

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bapabear

03/18/2010 05:12PM

Doc,

I like what you did there. It looks nice and should be functional. I've gotta ask though where did you get the felt? Is it a certain thickness? I need something on my 1972 Sawyer fiberglass canoe but don't want too much bulk "look" when done.

May waters rise to meet you. May wind and current be always at your back. May the Good Lord paddle with you, And may yours be the lightest pack.

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Koda

03/18/2010 06:07PM

cowdoc, great idea to use regular felt instead of kevlar felt. Yours will probably last nearly as long as kevlar skid plates at a fraction of the cost.

I agree that internal skid plates make no sense. It's even a misnomer, since if they're on the inside they don't skid at all. It seems to be just a little insurance in case you wear through the outer epoxy coat (or gelcoat), the epoxy-impregnated fabric, *and* the inner epoxy coat. Anyone who does that to a canoe should have their paddler's license revoked.

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cowdoc

03/18/2010 07:10PM

I'm not sure exactly what it's called. It's a thinner felt with a thinner weave. I cut out the shape I want, lay it on a piece of cellophane and soak it in epoxy (heavily), then place it on the canoe on a thin layer of epoxy. After placement, I lay another sheet of cellophane over it and use my hands to smooth it out nice and remove all the air bubbles. Gently remove the cellophane after that. It dries fairly rough, but you can sand it smooth and cover it with another layer of epoxy. Repeat if needed. It has worked well and is a fraction of the cost of kevlar skid plate kits.

"What could happen?"

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kanoes

03/18/2010 07:23PM

is it regular felt? like from a fabric store?

i think bigfoot is blurry. (mitch hedberg)

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cowdoc

03/18/2010 07:43PM

"What could happen?"

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Banksiana

03/18/2010 10:55PM

The "internal" skid plates that wenonah uses are mats of dense kevlar felt in the bow and stern beneath the final gel or clear coat. The idea is that this material is much more resistant to abrasion than regular kevlar or graphite cloth.

Steal a little and they throw you in jail. Steal a lot and they make you king.

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Koda

03/19/2010 12:55PM

quote Banksiana: "The "internal" skid plates that wenonah uses are mats of dense kevlar felt in the bow and stern beneath the final gel or clear coat. The idea is that this material is much more resistant to abrasion than regular kevlar or graphite cloth."

Thanks, Banks. So it's the middle of the sandwich instead of a piece of bread. But it still doesn't make sense to me. It's like setting up a chessboard with the pawns on the back row.

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03/19/2010 01:35PM

"Thanks, Banks. So it's the middle of the sandwich instead of a piece of bread. But it still doesn't make sense to me. It's like setting up a chessboard with the pawns on the back row."

great analogy!

that's how I ro'

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Jackfish

Moderator

03/19/2010 01:43PM

"Internal" skid plates? I think that might be a misspelling, or at least a misnomer.

I believe "Integral" skid plates are the skid plates that are installed on the canoe during the manufacturing process.

My kevlar canoe has Integral skid plates and I'm glad to have them.

It's only a spot on the map... until you go there.

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mwd1976

03/19/2010 01:51PM

I look at internal/integral skidplates as being as much for impact resistance as skid resistance. I know Souris River's are actually exposed, though they are not proud of the hull of the canoe. Which is a good thing. I'm not sure of other manufacturers.

see here

We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children -Chief Seattle

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bapabear

03/19/2010 05:32PM

This thread's a great example of how I learn new stuff on this site. I need some skid plates on my canoe and have gotten some great insight on how to it effectively yet with less cost.

May waters rise to meet you. May wind and current be always at your back. May the Good Lord paddle with you, And may yours be the lightest pack.

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moose plums

03/19/2010 06:00PM

quote Old Scout: "Another option to kevlar skid plates.

I have a solo canoe that came with a rolled on epoxy / graphite powder skid layer on the bow and stern.

I have had to redo them a couple of times over the last 7 years, but it does work.

It is simply a layer of epoxy and graphite powder that I roll on with a foam roller. The graphite powder makes the skid area a nice black color and it doesn't change the performance of the canoe. The skid area extends down under the bow and stern about 12" on the bottom of the canoe and up the stem area (about 2" on either side) to the gunwales."

Old Scout: I'd be interested to know where you get that stuff. My Bell Magic had the same stuff on it when I bought it. It's getting worn out now....anything you can tell me?

"I am haunted by waters"~Norman Maclean "A River Runs Through It"

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Boppa

03/19/2010 06:54PM

Yet another option or at least my 2 cents would be to look at Rec'Repair's skid plate material. I have installed these skid plates on my Souris River kevlar and am quite pleased with the result. The advantages for me were 1) I could custom cut (with scissors) to the size I determined necessary for the protection I wanted. I would recommend a heat gun over a hair dryer for an incredible molded fit of the material to your bow and stern before the adhesive is used. I have a total of 2 feet of protection on both bow and stern and it added a total of 14OZ. to the weight of the canoe, ( yes, I weighed it before and after). Performance is not affected in any way that I am noticing.

However, I would add that with the conditions encountered in the BWCAW and here in the Adirondacks any skid plate is better than none. Just another choice to consider.
Boppa

"Yesterday is the past, Tomorrow is the future, Today is a GIFT, that is why it is called the present".

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Kevlar

03/20/2010 06:24PM

Cowdoc, a great idea with the felt. I have used a fiberglass matting (bought at the same fiberglass and resin supply store) for a skid plate, and doubled it at the heavy wear spots. It ends up about 1/8" thick before doubling, and it is much cheaper than the kevlar kit. Bought by the yard, it was about $6.00, and then a quart of the goup. I don't wory much about how it looks with the extra little lump, 'cause that part is usually in the water.

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Old Scout

Guest Paddler

03/21/2010 09:40AM

Moose Plums, I just use the West epoxy system and add the powdered graphite (carbon black) to the mix, you can also add a little colloidal silica to thicken it up a bit. I usually roll on a couple of lighter coats rather then one thick coat.

I just tape off the lines of the existing skid layer and use an exacto knife to cut the curves out of the tape.

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Koda

03/21/2010 11:29AM

quote Boppa: "Yet another option or at least my 2 cents would be to look at Rec'Repair's skid plate material. I have installed these skid plates on my Souris River kevlar and am quite pleased with the result. The advantages for me were 1) I could custom cut (with scissors) to the size I determined necessary for the protection I wanted. I would recommend a heat gun over a hair dryer for an incredible molded fit of the material to your bow and stern before the adhesive is used. I have a total of 2 feet of protection on both bow and stern and it added a total of 14OZ. to the weight of the canoe, ( yes, I weighed it before and after). Performance is not affected in any way that I am noticing.
Boppa"

Boppa, do you know if it's possible to remove the Rec'Repair material? Or is it likely to outlast the boat?

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moose plums

03/21/2010 02:01PM

quote Old Scout: "Moose Plums, I just use the West epoxy system and add the powdered graphite (carbon black) to the mix, you can also add a little colloidal silica to thicken it up a bit. I usually roll on a couple of lighter coats rather then one thick coat.

I just tape off the lines of the existing skid layer and use an exacto knife to cut the curves out of the tape."

Thanks Old Scout

"I am haunted by waters"~Norman Maclean "A River Runs Through It"

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Boppa

03/21/2010 04:07PM

quote Koda: "quote Boppa: "Yet another option or at least my 2 cents would be to look at Rec'Repair's skid plate material. I have installed these skid plates on my Souris River kevlar and am quite pleased with the result. The advantages for me were 1) I could custom cut (with scissors) to the size I determined necessary for the protection I wanted. I would recommend a heat gun over a hair dryer for an incredible molded fit of the material to your bow and stern before the adhesive is used. I have a total of 2 feet of protection on both bow and stern and it added a total of 14OZ. to the weight of the canoe, ( yes, I weighed it before and after). Performance is not affected in any way that I am noticing.
Boppa"

"
Boppa, do you know if it's possible to remove the Rec'Repair material? Or is it likely to outlast the boat?""

Koda,
I do not believe or expect that the Rec'Repair skid plates are easily removed. They were put on with a very good epoxy. I have had them on our canoe for one season and the skid plates are tough. I do not expect to be the one to replace them if required.
If they had to come off, I would expect to start with my small belt sander - Ugh.
Boppa

"Yesterday is the past, Tomorrow is the future, Today is a GIFT, that is why it is called the present".

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Koda

03/21/2010 11:15PM

Thanks, Boppa.

I once had a Sundowner with pre-formed fiberglass skid plates.

The guy I bought it from said they were made by a custom auto body man. They were just glued on.

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PineKnot

06/12/2010 11:50AM

Well, I finished putting skidplates on my Northwind. After reading the earlier threads, I went with black felt and epoxy...came out pretty well. I just couldn't get myself to use the gold kevlar strips that came in the skip plate kit. I've since taken the Northwind out twice on a local lake with a sandy/rocky beach, and the plates seem quite rugged. The real test will be when I finally begin my Quetico adventures in late June and July.

Do what you can, with what you have, where you are -- Teddy Roosevelt

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