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Kawishiwi Lodge
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 Boundary Waters Quetico Forum Listening Point - General Discussion Cavity Wild Fire Info Discussion Reply
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View BWCA Photo and Trip Report Contest Page
Poll: What is your favorite month in the BWCA/Q?
| Previous Messages: | |
| Author | Message Text |
| WoodPaddle |
07/26/2006 09:13AM Interesting pictures of the fire. http://www.boreal.org/fireinfo/Cavity_Lake_Fire/photo_gallery.html |
| VoyageurNorth |
07/25/2006 09:48PM Adam, that really is a cool map! I love that you can increase the size/view & it still all comes in SO clear! |
| wolfwatcher |
07/25/2006 04:27PM Little Knife Lake opens for camping. Fire containment 35% Here's the noon press release today: http://199.134.225.50/nwcc/t1_pnw2/2006/cavity-lake/media-updates/documents/20060725-1200-little-knife-lake-reopens.pdf Great map, Adam! |
| DAVE |
07/25/2006 02:04PM I was camping at Perent Lake (Hog Creek #36) near the Sawbill trail and didn't see or smell any smoke or fire over the weekend. I guess it all depends where the wind blows. |
| adam |
07/25/2006 12:26PM I created this flash map with data from 7/23. It shows where the fire had reached by that point: Cavity Lake Fire Map |
| gravelroad |
07/24/2006 01:05PM Soem good news today: Fire Managers Re-Open Portages and Lakes in the Boundary Waters July 24, 2006 12 P.M. CAVITY LAKE INCIDENT COMMAND POST – Due to improved weather conditions and a fire containment of 30%, Forest Service managers, coordinated with the Unified Fire Command, are re-opening several portages and lakes on the northeast and east sides of the Cavity Lake Fire. The following areas within the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness will be open effective Monday, July 24 at 12:00 P.M.: • Red Rock Bay on Sag Lake; • Devils Walk of Sag Lake; • Cross Bay Entry Point (Ham Lake); • Missing Link Entry Point, however, Tuscarora Portage to Owl Portage remains closed; • Seagull Lake is open to camping east of the line from Paulson Lake Portage, north, to the Palisades. Paulson Lake Portage remains closed. The remainder of Seagull Lake west of this line remains open to day-use only. In order to gain access, visitors must have a self-issued day-use permit in their possession. Motorized use is permitted only in designated areas. Only fire personnel are permitted to utilize motorized boats within restricted areas. For more information, please contact the Gunflint Ranger District at (218) 387-1750. (NOTE: You can find the entire list of current closures at http://www.fs.fed.us/r9/forests/superior/fire/index.php.) |
| gravelroad |
07/23/2006 01:58PM More bad news, this time excerpted from today's (July 23) Duluth News Tribune: Wildfire notebook: 11 days and counting BY JANNA GOERDT NEWS TRIBUNE STAFF WRITER * * * * * * Jim Wiinanen carefully nosed the fishing boat through narrow channels and around tiny rock islands on Seagull Lake. Sparse rainfall had kept the lake low and smoke and ash drifted in the air, though the view ahead was postcard-perfect. Wiinanen eased the boat along the Palisade Cliff, a sheer expanse of granite dotted here and there with tenacious juniper and birch trees and a raven's nest. Palisade is cherished by locals, who make the steep climb to picnic and savor a view toward the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness. The Hamm's Beer company used to film commercials from atop the cliff, looking down Seagull Lake into those legendary sky blue waters. But as Wiinanen, a resource specialist with the U.S. Forest Service, rounded Palisade, the view changed. Stately white pines, now stripped of their branches and needles, thrust black and bare against the gray sky. Entire root systems of pines growing on bedrock had burned away, leaving the trees anchorless and ready to topple. Flames still licked at thick stumps here and there. The island had caught fire Sunday night and burned in a mosaic pattern, with patches of green hugging the shore alongside trees that had turned to charcoal. Ground crews worked on the smoking island for days putting out hot spots. |
| gravelroad |
07/23/2006 01:39PM Before you read what follows, please keep these things in mind: 1. The Cavity Lake fire does not affect every part of the BWCA. You can find out exactly what has burned, hwat is closed, and what is open by checking the links posted elsewhere in this thread above. If you have plans, please check the facts before altering or cancelling. 2. Fire and storm blowdowns are part of what made and continue to make the BWCA what it is. The relatively short term perspective we have as humans during our individual lifetimes should not blind us to this fact. Now for some hard news to hear during this writer's individual lifetime: Cavity Lake fire damage will shock many, official says The Cavity Lake wildfire “has changed the landscape out there, and it’s going to be shocking when you see it,” a Forest Service official warned residents and vacationers this morning. Warren Wolfe, Star Tribune Last update: July 23, 2006 – 11:43 AM ON THE GUNFLINT TRAIL –- The Cavity Lake wildfire “has changed the landscape out there, and it’s going to be shocking when you see it,” a Forest Service official warned residents and vacationers this morning. “Give yourself a chance to cry, if you need,” said Dennis Nietzke, supervisor of the Superior National Forest. “The landmarks you remember, many of them, are gone.” Nietzke said he inspected parts of the area along Sea Gull Lake that burned last week and was bothered by what he saw. “It’s hard not to get a little emotional. One guy told me he lost a lot of friends out there” when millions of trees burned. Sea Gull Lake, on the Northeast side of the 51-square-mle fire, was reopened to day-visitors on Saturday. Ten percent of the fire now is contained, officials said. However, new areas west of the fire zone were closed to canoeists today because firefighters intend to start backfires in that area to slow the wildfire growth. The precise area will be announced later today. Firefighters were helped this morning when rain showers dampened the area. “It’s not enough to put anything out, but it helps keep the grass and twigs from igniting,” said Erik Christiansen, fire behavior specialist with the national team leading the effort. In fact, it may slow efforts to start backfires on the south and west sides of the fire in the Boundary Waters Canoe Area, said team commander Mike Lohrey. “Today the rain is a little help and a little hindrance.” |
| wolfwatcher |
07/23/2006 11:58AM Here's a link to the closures. I would contact the Forest Service, Gunflint District for additional information. http://www.fs.fed.us/r9/forests/superior/fire/documents/Closures7_22.doc |
| New Guy |
07/23/2006 09:13AM We are going in Missing link in a week. Are they letting people with clsoed EPs get permits for areas above the quota? I have hear some second hand reports and have not been able to confirm. Who would I call? Thanks! |
| dogwoodgirl |
07/22/2006 02:53AM The smoke from the fires up north has officially reached Duluth tonight. I'm due to go in on Lake One Weds, still going somewhere but wondering if we will end up in the U.P. instead. My son has some concerns with asthma, so I guess we'll take it as it comes. Our group is too large for Sylvania, but maybe a remote cabin in the Porkies. Sigh. |
| bogwalker |
07/21/2006 12:06PM The management of the Cavity Lake Fire has been tranferred. The Pacific Northwest National Incident Management Team 2, which is a Type 1 national fire team is now in control of the fighting. They will soon post information on the fire to their website in addition to the other websites. Thier web address is: http://199.134.225.50/nwcc/t1_pnw2/ Look for updates to be posted soon. |
| BAYVIEW |
07/21/2006 11:27AM thanks for the reply bw. you know that is one aspect of the fire that i didnt even think about....the solitude is one of the most endearing things about the whole area. i will hope for the best...but i will settle for whatever, as long as i am out there fishin'..knowwatimean. |
| kcbace |
07/20/2006 02:25PM We'll be entering on Little Gabbro on Saturday(7-22) and staying through Saturday(7-29. Entry 33. I will give reports as to the area as soon as I get back. |
| bogwalker |
07/20/2006 02:10PM Bower Trout is quite a ways from where the fire is located. If the fires are still burning you may smell them, but you won't see the effects of them as it has not come close to that area. Probably the biggest impact will be the people. I expect everyone with plans to go will now be using the permits every place but where the fires were to insure they get the scenery they want. I would expect the area to be a bit busier than it might have been if no fire had occured. |
| BAYVIEW |
07/20/2006 02:02PM heading up first week of august. friends who just got back from grand marais tell me the area is pretty messed up from the fire. planing on entry at #43- bower trout, what should i be prepared for as far as the fire goes?? .....thanks |
| Wetward |
07/20/2006 01:00PM Yeah, I figured the area will be busy. I didn't get any special treatment to get the permit they just had one available for the same day. Where else are the adding extra permit to for those who are canceled and who do I call? There are not many option in the Gabbro area because of the Turtle fire and I would love to get a new permit somewhere else. Is it unrealistic to pray for a foot of snow so I can still use my Brandt lake permit? My wife thinks so but she a pessimist. |
| gravelroad |
07/20/2006 09:18AM The Forest Service is posting fire-related closure info (entry points, portages, etc.) at http://www.fs.fed.us/r9/forests/superior/fire/index.php. |
| mr.barley |
07/19/2006 10:06PM Yeah Wetward, it's kind of long but it's easy. Kind of like a highway compared to some I've been on. And there is only one if you stay on Little Gabbro or Gabbro. You may want to look at sites on the Kawishawi River to avoid some people. Of coarse that's another 120 rod portage. |
| VoyageurNorth |
07/19/2006 10:00PM You are right, the FS is issuing a few permits for those areas to people who had their entry point totally closed. But for any body else, no new permit reservation would be issued for those areas. Lake One entry is also "frozen" for the next few days. If you already have a permit you are fine, but if not (unless you are one of the entry closed people, you can't reserve one yet. |
| schweady |
07/19/2006 06:47PM Wetward- Glad you could get a new permit, altho I am surprised. I had heard that Little Gabbro was one that was remaining open but no new permits due to anticipated crowding of areas still open. Probably becasue they cancelled your existing one. (?) I suggest looking for a site early on; it's bound to be a bit busier than usual thereabouts. Don't sweat the long portage. (no pun intended) It's not a difficult one. Just take note that both the map on this website and the Mckenzie map (not sure about the latest Fisher map) have the Little Gabbro portage marked incorrectly. The portage actually hits the water across the bay almost directly north from where it is marked... just south of that westernmost campsite. The nice thing about the relocation is that it is now only 192 rods, according to my gps. |
| Wetward |
07/19/2006 03:24PM My trip was August 5 -12. I just got a new permit for Lillte Gabbro (long portage!) but kept the old one in case they reopen which is unlikely. They will give a complete refund if the EP is closed. I also think the fire will burn for awhile. Out west they burn unitl 1st snow fall |
| Presto |
07/19/2006 03:16PM budro- Don't sweat it. Better to have your permit changed. I'm guessing they won't let people near the fire area until after labor day. There is such a huge potential for flare ups in the region. I bet this fire will smolder for months. |
| budro |
07/19/2006 02:36PM I was scheduled to go through EP52 on 8/4, but I've now switched to South Moose River on the west side. Two of us are flying in from CA and two others from the east coast, and we just didn't want to risk not being able to get in after so much planning and traveling. Plus, our outfitter (Tuscarora) recommended we find another entry for that date if possible -- I really respected their honesty. I'm disappointed because this is my first trip in 8 years and we'd really looked forward to the route. Then again, I'm thankful we weren't there this week because we would've been right in the middle of it. Good luck and safe travels. |
| Andy |
07/19/2006 01:00PM To Wetward: When was your trip planned? I have one planned for Aug 4-11, doing a Seagull to Knife to Sag loop, and a majority of the route is currently shut down. I am going to hold my breath and pray for rain - maybe the Seagull entry will open up before the 4th. Sorry about your trip! |
| Wetward |
07/19/2006 12:39PM I sit here with mixed emotion. On one had fire is a natural force that, in a way, gives birth to the forest I love. On the other hand ITS RUINING MY EXPLETIVE TRIP!!!!! Ok, I feel a little better now. Can I get a moment of silence for all of the canceled trips... Thanks (runs from room crying) |
| lucynet |
07/18/2006 11:43PM MNJim, Thanks for the story on the downdraft. I keep thinking it could have been me struggling out there because I wanted to get a closer look. I guess nature doesn't make allowances. I really hope everyone concerned remains safe and sound. From what I've seen of the weather forecast, could that downdraft scenario repeat itself tomorrow? Thursday? |
| schweady |
07/18/2006 11:05PM groupleader- You would be well advised to keep close tabs on the (for now) smaller fire, the Turtle Lake Wildfire. Your entry is still open, but the fire ban recently imposed on the entire blowdown area (new boundaries for 2006) apply to the portion of Snowbank within the BWCAW and basically all lakes on routes leading in from there. No open fires at any time until further notice. You certainly will smell, if not see, smoke. |
| MNJim |
07/18/2006 10:14PM lucynet, I certainly don't have the whole story but what I gather is that everyone was caught off guard by the thunderstorm that hit south of the fire. It apparently had an extremely strong downdraft. When the downdraft hit the ground it produced horizontal winds in the 50 to 60 mph range. Before the storm the Cavity Lake fire was burning in an easterly direction driven by the prevailing winds. It was suddenly hit with these high winds coming from the south and the fire direction suddenly changed from easterly to the north. I just saw these guys and their photos on the local news. Before the fire was hit by the high winds the lake was like glass. They reported that after the wind hit the fire turned into a firestorm and there was two to four feet of chop on the water. This happened very quickly. When they entered there was a fire moving to the east and not headed where they were heading. The downdraft hits and they found themselves in the path of a firestorm. I think that it goes without saying that if you enter a wilderness area containing hundreds of thousands of acres of fuel during a hot-dry period, you better be careful. Entering when there's a fire within a few miles of where you plan to be may not be the smartest thing you ever did. I'm not second guessing these guys for entering in these conditions, but I think I would have gone with plan B. |
| lucynet |
07/18/2006 06:15PM Thanks for the blog links. Very good info there. Undoubtedly much hard work and heroic activity is being done to keep people safe during this fire. Anyone who has camped in the blowdown area in the past few years (I think) knows that the dry, stacked wood and brush in this dry weather must be primed to burn like a huge bonfire. I'm not an expert, but looking at the weather forecast and the quickly expanding perimeter makes me think that this fire will burn out of control until all of the unburned blowdown forest is consumed - and may take some non-blowdown forest with it as well. Perhaps this is the "worst case" scenario, but the last few days as I look at the maps and look at the pictures and read the stories, see the trends and then look at the weather forecast... That said, if I had a pending trip this summer I would still go - as long as conditions were not dangerous at the time. I would listen to officials, but would also use common sense and check alternative info sources like this one - and the blogs you posted earlier. |
| Cedarboy |
07/18/2006 04:28PM Chad and Groupleader Snowbank is actually in the central part of BWCAW, just west and northwest of the 2 fires burning. You need to recheck the maps and fires. West BWCAW is up the Echo trail entrys 14, 16 etc except for out of Crane in through LLC. Recheck for closed lakes eastof Snowbank. Cedarboy |
| Wolfwatcher |
07/18/2006 04:26PM lucynet, I read that article as well, and I'm concerned about the alleged lack of action on the part of the USFS and the outfitter where safety is clearly an issue. There's another story from the Duluth paper that's also rather scary -- http://www.duluthsuperior.com/mld/duluthsuperior/15065400.htm "Forest Service crews will attempt to escort out a group of seven campers who have been waiting along the perimeter of the fire on Ogishkemuncie Lake for three days, said Tom Kaffin, a public safety officer with the Forest Service. Two crews will lead the campers out through the heart of the fire, an area which burned intensely but is now mostly charred wood, Kaffin said." At this point I just hope they can get the fires contained and everyone involved is safe. I have a huge admiration for wildland firefighters. A couple of Gunflint Trail bloggers are keeping close tabs on the situation: http://boundarycountry.blogspot.com http://www.boundarywatersblog.com |
| lucynet |
07/18/2006 03:33PM Wolfwatcher, I just read the articles you linked to at Duluth News Tribune, and happened upon another article posted today: "Paddlers escape, shaken but safe, from wind-swept flames" http://www.duluthsuperior.com/mld/duluthsuperior/15064399.htm About a party camping on Miles Island on Sea Gull Lake barely making it out in front of the wildfire. The disturbing part of this story was that all the while (according to the campers) they had been given assurances by US Forest Service and their outfitter staff that the fire wasn't jumping, they were not in danger and that if conditions changed, someone would come to get them out (which, according to them, also didn't happen). I know that part of managing a fire is to reassure the public and keep people calm and all that, but people going in deserve to know the unvarnished facts so that they can make an informed decision. Perhaps this fire took everyone by surprise, but the tone of this story makes it seem as if these campers' legitimate concerns may have been dismissed by the "experienced" people resulting in a false sense of safety which put them in danger. In the last 2 years when visiting the BWCA, my husband and I have observed wildfires across the lake and watched the firefighting planes and helicopters. We have been alert and conscious that we were camping in a virtual "tinderbox" that could flare up at any time - and have been watchful and cautious with our own fire use. The Alpine fire last year burned out at least one island and threatened others. I am confused about this report that US Forest Rangers would reassure campers that this fire would not "jump" to the islands, tell them that someone would get them if it did, and then when conditions DID change, left them there. Is this report true? What could those rangers have been thinking? What could the outfitter staff have been thinking when they told the 3 campers asking for help for their friends to "wait until morning?" I have always had a lot of respect for those making a livelihood in the wilderness. Does anyone have information that would help explain? I believe there must be good intentions here that somehow went wrong. |
| Chad |
07/18/2006 03:02PM Hey Groupleader - Snowbank is listed as entry point 27, thats on the west side of the BWCA. The fire (as far as I can tell as they haven't published any updated maps at http://www.mnics.org/ or http://www.boreal.org/) is more on the north east area of the BWCA near the Gunflint. I would think you'd be fine entering at Snowbank, but check with your outfitter to be sure. |
| Cedarboy |
07/18/2006 02:23PM WOW Just looked at the map, it really has increased in size since yesterday. I asthrough ther twice since the blow, LOTS OF FUEL, we can only pray for rain and keep those fire fighters safe!! Those are some pretty scarey pics!!! cedarboy |
| Sarah |
07/18/2006 12:00PM Do you think there is a possibility entry point 52 will reopen this summer? I have a trip planned for Aug 25th (my first trip) and I am so excited! If it is closed will we be able to choose from different entry points or be bumped out for the summer? Any info would help! |
| groupleader |
07/18/2006 11:43AM chad-I'm heading into the wilderness Aug 14th as well. I'm putting in at Snowbank. I don't have my maps in front of me, in releation to snowbank, where is this fire located? |
| Wolfwatcher |
07/18/2006 11:32AM Here are a couple of links with updated info: http://www.duluthsuperior.com/mld/duluthsuperior/15065400.htm http://www.duluthsuperior.com/mld/duluthsuperior/15061471.htm http://www.boreal.org/fireinfo/Cavity_Lake_Fire/photo_gallery.html |
| soledad |
07/18/2006 11:03AM I was hiking last year around Snowbank, and soiled my brand new yellow Osprey pack with some soot while ducking under a burnt tree. Now I get to think about that trip everytime I put on my pack. Praying for muddy portages... might have to perform a rain dance very soon, the outlook for a good long rain doesn't look too good. |
| hexnymph |
07/18/2006 09:36AM I'm located on the Keweenaw peninsula on the other side of Superior... I could see the smoke on Saturday and last night you could smell it. I agree with ekffazr, I think it would be neat to travel through that area. I'm sure the bushwacking would be easier. I wonder how long my gear would be stained with black smut. Hex |
| nolanbunch |
07/17/2006 09:36PM Video of the fires here: http://www.startribune.com/1741/v-video/story/557919.html Looks pretty intimidating from the air. Stay safe out there. |
| TWeiss |
07/17/2006 06:25PM Looks like you can see smoke in the Moose Lake web cam: http://elyminnesota.com/cams/moose_lake_cam/index.php |
| Beavers |
07/17/2006 05:58PM Check out these awesome photo's of the fire. |
| ekffazr |
07/17/2006 02:19PM I think.......going into an area that burned, would make for an interesting and completely different trip. Obviousley only if the area is opened and deemed safe by the Forest service and any other powers that be. I know that going through seagull and Alpine 3 days after the blowdown was a unique trip that I shall not forget. always keeping in mind that safety must be first in this area, and we can be reasonably sure they wont allow entry if there are still issues in that area. just my humble thoughts and opinions firefighters be safe and thank you!!!!! |
| Chad |
07/17/2006 11:26AM Big bummer for our Aug 14 trip into BWCA via entry 52. We're getting on the horn with our outfitter (Tuscorora) for options. Any recommendations from anyone would be appreciated - even if Entry 52 is opened by Aug 14, would it be unwise/unsafe (due to smoke, possible flare up) to go in? We had planned on staying at a wonderful spot on Gillis once again this year, but are open to other sites if you have recommendations for a large party (there are eight of us). Thanks much and Godspeed to the fire fighters. Chad |
| adam |
07/16/2006 09:40AM This fire is in and around Cavity Lake which is southeast of Alpine Lake and south of Seagull Lake off the Gunflint trail. Here is a link to the main update page on this - Link Here is some text information about the fire - Link here Entry point 52 and 56 (Kek Trail East) have been closed. Portages that are closed are Seagull Lake to Jap Lake, Seagull to Alpine Lake, Seagull to Rog, and Rog to Alpine Lake. Link to map |
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